The Mandate

Guard Dad

Administrator
Staff member
There's a huge discussion about this going on at the other forum I admin. The reality is, a lot of people are dead set (perhaps a poor choice of words) against the vaccine. And I think forcing it upon them is only solidifying their opposition.

I say again, a better strategy from the government would be educating the public instead of dividing them and pitting people against each other.
 

Radiohead

Stunt Driver
There's a huge discussion about this going on at the other forum I admin. The reality is, a lot of people are dead set (perhaps a poor choice of words) against the vaccine. And I think forcing it upon them is only solidifying their opposition.

I say again, a better strategy from the government would be educating the public instead of dividing them and pitting people against each other.
But you can't educate the public with lies.
 

The Sound Guy

Pursuit Driver
There's a huge discussion about this going on at the other forum I admin. The reality is, a lot of people are dead set (perhaps a poor choice of words) against the vaccine. And I think forcing it upon them is only solidifying their opposition.

I say again, a better strategy from the government would be educating the public instead of dividing them and pitting people against each other.

Yep. The AJC is doing an education push, which I think is the way to go. I know my cousin, who was anti-vax, went to Rabid Anti Vax as soon as the mandate was announced. Cold day in Hell type of response.
 

The Sound Guy

Pursuit Driver
...... however, that don't stop them (da govmint) from trying and trying and trying again, amiright?

More the Liberals (we know what's best and you'd better do it) but we saw some of that from the Trump Administration as well. I will give the Trump Admin a little break that they were facing it with very little absolute knowledge, just announcements that various science teams announce, without review.
 

J-man

Let's Go Brandon!!!
Staff member
Education will only go so far, what’s missing is confidence in the educators. Speaking for myself, at the moment I would not even consider taking either vaccine. Keep in mind I’m in the higher risk category being over 50, over 200 lbs, Type II diabetic with a past history of asthma. If the messaging was reliable, consistent, and science based I would have been one of the first in line. Hopefully soon this virus will subside or at least alternative treatments with few side affects will be approved and readily available.
 

Far West

Pursuit Driver
To be honest, now I wonder why I took to stupid shot.

Now it has become evident it is temporary at best, as I now know fully vaccinated people who have gotten Covid. Worst yet, they are in their early 20's and would not have had any worse a case than they had even without the jab.

The variants are not coming from the USA, so blaming un-vaxed on that is dishonest too.

The politicians are losing their minds because, as in Biden's case, he promised to cure Covid... it is not working out so well for him, becaseu a mere mortal can't control a virus.

It is becoming clear to me the virus will run its course. We must protect the elderly and those with underlying conditions... just as I have said since this started.
 

cptlo

Pursuit Driver
Given how bad Delta has been and continues to be, what situation would we be in right now if there were no vaccines? Would it be worse than last year? Probably. Much worse? Given how much easier Delta spreads....probably.

The information provided by both the Biden administration and the Trump administration has been bad...no question. To me, it is simple....given the percentage of hospitalized folks that are unvaccinated, the vaccines work. Will they work forever? Nope. I don't think many people (or perhaps anyone) has ever said they would.
 

Far West

Pursuit Driver
Given how bad Delta has been and continues to be, what situation would we be in right now if there were no vaccines? Would it be worse than last year? Probably. Much worse? Given how much easier Delta spreads....probably.

The information provided by both the Biden administration and the Trump administration has been bad...no question. To me, it is simple....given the percentage of hospitalized folks that are unvaccinated, the vaccines work. Will they work forever? Nope. I don't think many people (or perhaps anyone) has ever said they would.
Not so sure. Natural immunity, after having it, seems to be the way we are going to get out of this; even if the politicians don't want to even acknowledge that.

A comment that sums up the push back:

Injection mandates for a free people is unconstitutional under the 4th amendment . Fauxci and President Vegetable, and their band of merry dictators, aka demokkkrat governors, can shove it where the sun don't shine!
 

cptlo

Pursuit Driver
Not so sure. Natural immunity, after having it, seems to be the way we are going to get out of this; even if the politicians don't want to even acknowledge that.

A comment that sums up the push back:

Injection mandates for a free people is unconstitutional under the 4th amendment . Fauxci and President Vegetable, and their band of merry dictators, aka demokkkrat governors, can shove it where the sun don't shine!

I agree with that statement for federal mandates also, but that isn't my point. Relying on natural immunity for everyone is what we did last year before the vaccines and look at how many people were hospitalized and died. Look at how many of the natural immunity (unvaccinated) folks are being hospitalized and dying this year. Remove vaccines from the picture and the number of people hospitalized and dying would go up dramatically.
 

Guard Dad

Administrator
Staff member
Given how bad Delta has been and continues to be, what situation would we be in right now if there were no vaccines? Would it be worse than last year? Probably. Much worse? Given how much easier Delta spreads....probably.

The information provided by both the Biden administration and the Trump administration has been bad...no question. To me, it is simple....given the percentage of hospitalized folks that are unvaccinated, the vaccines work. Will they work forever? Nope. I don't think many people (or perhaps anyone) has ever said they would.
I think Delta has about shot it's wad. I was told by a smart person I follow that it would come in like a lion but not last long.

I also think that between the vaccines and natural immunity, we are at some level of herd immunity. Now, I assume radical mutations of the virus could change that, but for now I think things are looking better. I know there are a lot of people currently sick, but after that the numbers should level out some.
 

Guard Dad

Administrator
Staff member
I agree with that statement for federal mandates also, but that isn't my point. Relying on natural immunity for everyone is what we did last year before the vaccines and look at how many people were hospitalized and died. Look at how many of the natural immunity (unvaccinated) folks are being hospitalized and dying this year. Remove vaccines from the picture and the number of people hospitalized and dying would go up dramatically.
Well, the numbers weren't there yet. I think we're close now, and the vaccines likely played a role in that.

I just wish the government would recognize that natural immunity did as well. From the latest data out, natural immunity just might last much longer than the vaccines.
 

MudFlap

Expert Driver
To be honest, now I wonder why I took to stupid shot.

Now it has become evident it is temporary at best, as I now know fully vaccinated people who have gotten Covid. Worst yet, they are in their early 20's and would not have had any worse a case than they had even without the jab.

The variants are not coming from the USA, so blaming un-vaxed on that is dishonest too.

The politicians are losing their minds because, as in Biden's case, he promised to cure Covid... it is not working out so well for him, becaseu a mere mortal can't control a virus.

It is becoming clear to me the virus will run its course. We must protect the elderly and those with underlying conditions... just as I have said since this started.
I think that this thing is going to be around for a very, very long time.
It will be just like the common cold and seasonal flu.
 

J-man

Let's Go Brandon!!!
Staff member
What's the answer for those adversely affected by the vaccine, those who otherwise were healthy with no medical conditions prior to taking the vaccine? When will the numbers accurately reflect that elderly people are also dying from "normal" elderly conditions and not just from Covid?
What happened to the "normal" flu? There are several things that come to mind from the chart below. ILI35_small.gif
 

Radiohead

Stunt Driver

HealthImpactNews
Sep 9
166 views
Vaccine Injuries from COVID-19 Shots Fill Hospitals as U.S. Government Lies and Claims a “Pandemic of Unvaccinated” The battle lines over mandatory COVID-19 vaccines are now going full steam ahead in the U.S. as the Biden Administration is announcing today that all federal employees must now get a COVID-19 shot as a condition for employment, and that they are eliminating the testing opt-out. The argument that only COVID-19 shots will end the endless "pandemic" and the lie that hospitals are over 90% full of unvaccinated people are being used as justification for mandatory mass vaccination. It doesn't take much research on one's own to bypass the corporate media and find out that they are lying, and that there are numerous reports that the exact opposite situation is now happening in the U.S. and around the world, which is that the hospitals are full of people who have already been vaccinated with COVID-19 shots and that the ones who have survived are now filling our hospitals. This is evident from the last release of data into the government Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS) database, which as of last Friday shows that following COVID-19 shots, there have been 13,911 deaths, 18,098 permanent disabilities, 76,160 ER visits, 56,912 hospitalizations, 2,933,377 injury symptoms, and 14,327 life threatening events. And just this past week, the Toronto Sun ran a story reporting that more than 100 Ontario youth were sent to the hospital for vaccine-related heart problems. Here is a video report I put together with testimony from nurses, a doctor, and an occupational therapist explaining what they are currently seeing in the hospitals, so you can hear it yourself from the frontline workers. #CovidBioweaponShots #medicaltyranny #plandemic #eugenics #WakeUpAmerica https://healthimpactnews.com/2021/v...t-lies-and-claims-a-pandemic-of-unvaccinated/
 

cptlo

Pursuit Driver
It doesn't take much research on one's own to bypass the corporate media and find out that they are lying, and that there are numerous reports that the exact opposite situation is now happening in the U.S. and around the world, which is that the hospitals are full of people who have already been vaccinated with COVID-19 shots and that the ones who have survived are now filling our hospitals.

I'd love to see some proof of this, if it exists.


Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS) database, which as of last Friday shows that following COVID-19 shots, there have been 13,911 deaths, 18,098 permanent disabilities, 76,160 ER visits, 56,912 hospitalizations, 2,933,377 injury symptoms, and 14,327 life threatening events.

The Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS) database contains information on unverified reports of adverse events (illnesses, health problems and/or symptoms) following immunization with US-licensed vaccines. Reports are accepted from anyone and can be submitted electronically at www.vaers.hhs.gov.

But I'm sure all the data provided via VAERS is accurate.


100 Ontario youth were sent to the hospital

Sounds very scary....but....

From this article: https://torontosun.com/news/provinc...o-hospital-for-vaccine-related-heart-problems

There have in total been 202 emergency room visits across all age groups for such issues following vaccination, with 146 leading to hospitalization. Three of these have led to ICU admission.

When it comes to older age brackets, there were 54 persons aged 25-39 included in the tally and 44 persons aged 40 and over.

When broken down by the number of overall people who have received the vaccines, the reporting rate for this side effect is 7.4 per million for Pfizer and 20 per million for Moderna.


0.00074 % and 0.002 %
 

deewee

Pursuit Driver
I cannot speak for everyone but the vast majority of anti-vaxxers I personally know are die hard Trumpers. I have to agree with Boss on that one. Now I obviously don't know that many people in the big scheme of things and I am not speaking for the minorities but in my personal world 95% of the antis are Trumpers. Did any of you get vaccinated for measles? Mumps? Polio? aren't most of these local government mandates to attend public school?

Our observations are the same.

Every single one of my close circle of friends is anti-vax and die hard Trumpers, too. And, the few Biden supporters I know are very pro-vax and believe it should be mandated.
 

J-man

Let's Go Brandon!!!
Staff member
I can't say I know many who are Biden supporters (other than GD) so I can't speak for that camp. I know many Trump supporters and I'll have to say of that circle the majority slightly favors anti-vax (Covid only). I know many Trump supporters who've taken the Covid vaccine, wear their masks when required, and would follow a vaccine mandate.

The big question is, of that later circle, how many would follow a mandate if initiated by Trump? As for me, as a Trump supporter, it still wouldn't change my mind. I will know when it's time and it won't be when any politician says it's time.
 
Top