civil forfeiture

[stradial]

People need to be more upset with the IRS. Whereas the odds are in your favor of not having your money seized by the mean 'ol popo, the scum at the IRS rape us every pay period at the point of a gun.

While I agree with your point about the IRS, but your answer is like those who when caught doing wrong say, "Yeh, but I only did a little wrong, look at those guys, they do a lot wrong.", instead of, "Yep, I was wrong."
Or, why stop me for speeding? That red car was going twice as fast as I was.
(sound familiar?)

Sorry, but I don't take responsibility for something that I have neither done or witnessed being done. No more than I apologize for slavery or anything else I have not been involved in. :dunno

And thus the reason cops get a bad name.

That response does not make sense.

It makes as much sense as your response to my post.

No one asked you to apologize for anything, much less slavery.
I was making the point that your answer of get mad at the IRS because the IRS steals a crap pot lot of money and not some cops stealing your money to use for their department is no different than me speeding but saying don't give me a ticket, there are people committing worse crimes.

Also, I presume you read my example of someone I personally know who had their truck seized under this law and have chosen not to address it because, a) it doesn't fit your agenda, b) you feel that the person probably had something to do with the illegal activity and deserved it, but do not wish to say that, c) LE never makes a mistake, d) all of the above.

My point is this, one of the things that whizzes the average Joe Blow off, is when there is pretty good evidence that LE is over stepping their bounds and someone who is, or was, a part of LE refuses to acknowledge that it is highly possible that LE has made a mistake.
In other words, that BS of the "brotherhood", the "blue line", which is just another way of saying, we don't admit to doing anything wrong because we belong to the same "club".
Hell, we all belong to one "club" or the other, but I don't ignore or refuse to admit that someone in my "club" did wrong when presented by stories or facts that they did, just because we are brothers.
And I'll tell you something else about my "club", I can promise we have buried more of our brothers and sisters in our "club" than you have in yours.
So life and death as an outcome is not the exclusive domain of your "club".

Just be human and say something like, "if what is reported is true, this is a problem, while I have never personally seen it or know someone who has seen it, but it could happen".

Just like the cops in New Orleans that were one of the biggest murder/robber gangs in the state at one time.
Heck they were doing contract killings, on duty, in uniform and driving patrol cars.

These "bad" cops do not reflect the majority of LE by any means, but they do exist and there are abuses of power and to not acknowledge it is wrong.
I myself have heard you say, I will start looking for things to give them a ticket for if they make me mad.
That is understandable from the human standpoint, but as a professional, it is flat out wrong.

Are you on drugs tonight? That is totally way off in left field and uncalled for. You owe GC an apology, big time!

And about your truck driver friend, did you not state that drugs WERE found in his vehicle?

Drugs found, vehicle confiscated, end of report! The rest is totally up to the courts and people who get paid way too much.

First, if you read what I wrote, he was the owner of the truck, not the driver.
Second, "end of report" is the type of response that like I said give cops a bad name.
Third, if I owe anyone an apology then that is for me to decide and not for anyone to tell me to do.

You need to check yourself, I am not your child, nor do you have me handcuffed in the back if your patrol car, so back off.

 

[Winchester]

Done with you dude, you have no idea what you're talking about.

 

[deewee]

I understand GC's response. I'm sure it came from a place of "I get so tired of having to defend my profession because of the actions of a few". Knowing GC, he was/is a top notch, honest, officer of the law. I give him every benefit of a doubt because I know what kind of environment these guys/gals work in. Do they get defensive sometimes? You're damn skippy they do. Maybe fly off a little when they feel they are being scrutinized, though they've done nothing wrong? Yep. Wouldn't we all? When he says he never witnessed such things, I believe him. My husband hasn't witnessed these incidences either, and he's been in law enforcement for 25 yrs.

Every single day, almost without exception, an officer can expect to go in to work defending himself against complaints from the public. Why? Because people that violate laws do not like getting caught, so they call and complain on the officer. The vast majority of these complaints are unfounded, and are nothing more than the "public" blowing off steam about getting busted for something.

Back to the topic- I know there is corruption in law enforcement, but I don't believe it to be as prolific as some would like us to believe. I'll say again, it's the dirty cops that make the job harder. They cause this "let's put the whole profession under a microscope" mentality.

 

[stradial]

Done with you dude, you have no idea what you're talking about.

I know, us poor ole dumb people, we just have no idea what we are talking about.
Thank god we have you smart people to tell us how it really is, other wise we are lucky to tie our shoes.
I am sick and tired of the superior attitude that some display at times.
Perhaps there are a few who need to look in the mirror and see if they don't owe some people apologies for being conceding and dismissive of others opinions and thoughts.
Some get their panties in a wad because they can't say something here and everyone agree, like they do when they have their badge and gun on.

Like I said, it is getting old.
I would live to see a couple of people be man enough to say, "I could be ring about that", heck, I'm not even asking for them to admit it when they are wrong.
Or say, "you know, you have a point, I disagree, but you do havea point".

I love it that when asked for examples and examples are given, they are either ignored or dismissed as being "not the way it happened", that is not only rude, it is stupid.

 

[stradial]

I understand GC's response. I'm sure it came from a place of "I get so tired of having to defend my profession because of the actions of a few". Knowing GC, he was/is a top notch, honest, officer of the law. I give him every benefit of a doubt because I know what kind of environment these guys/gals work in. Do they get defensive sometimes? You're damn skippy they do. Maybe fly off a little when they feel they are being scrutinized, though they've done nothing wrong? Yep. Wouldn't we all? When he says he never witnessed such things, I believe him. My husband hasn't witnessed these incidences either, and he's been in law enforcement for 25 yrs.

Every single day, almost without exception, an officer can expect to go in to work defending himself against complaints from the public. Why? Because people that violate laws do not like getting caught, so they call and complain on the officer. The vast majority of these complaints are unfounded, and are nothing more than the "public" blowing off steam about getting busted for something.

Back to the topic- I know there is corruption in law enforcement, but I don't believe it to be as prolific as some would like us to believe. I'll say again, it's the dirty cops that make the job harder. They cause this "let's put the whole profession under a microscope" mentality.

I understand, but to "defend" because it is "your profession" and that is the only reason, is why the public gets annoyed.
Call a spade a spade.
And despite what we may think Rockmart and Cobb are not the entire country.
Funny isn't it that mei lan mentions this practice is bad in TN and what happened in to my friend happened in TN.
Maybe, just maybe, they are doing wrong in TN.

 

[deewee]

I understand GC's response. I'm sure it came from a place of "I get so tired of having to defend my profession because of the actions of a few". Knowing GC, he was/is a top notch, honest, officer of the law. I give him every benefit of a doubt because I know what kind of environment these guys/gals work in. Do they get defensive sometimes? You're damn skippy they do. Maybe fly off a little when they feel they are being scrutinized, though they've done nothing wrong? Yep. Wouldn't we all? When he says he never witnessed such things, I believe him. My husband hasn't witnessed these incidences either, and he's been in law enforcement for 25 yrs.

Every single day, almost without exception, an officer can expect to go in to work defending himself against complaints from the public. Why? Because people that violate laws do not like getting caught, so they call and complain on the officer. The vast majority of these complaints are unfounded, and are nothing more than the "public" blowing off steam about getting busted for something.

Back to the topic- I know there is corruption in law enforcement, but I don't believe it to be as prolific as some would like us to believe. I'll say again, it's the dirty cops that make the job harder. They cause this "let's put the whole profession under a microscope" mentality.

I understand, but to "defend" because it is "your profession" and that is the only reason, is why the public gets annoyed.
Call a spade a spade.
And despite what we may think Rockmart and Cobb are not the entire country.
Funny isn't it that mei lan mentions this practice is bad in TN and what happened in to my friend happened in TN.
Maybe, just maybe, they are doing wrong in TN.

I agree that Rockmart & Cobb are not the entire country. I'm just responding from my corner of the country, using the knowledge I have of two seasoned police officers.

I know several officers I'd consider corrupt (for various reasons). Well, make that former officers. They were terminated for reasons other than what I know of them. No matter, they're no longer in law enforcement and I'm glad of it.

Officers are held to a higher standard because the enforce the law, which causes anything amiss to become a huge news story. Most are proud of their profession, and don't like it when their own integrity comes into question (due to these news stories stirring up public opinion) because of the acts of another.

 

[stradial]

I understand GC's response. I'm sure it came from a place of "I get so tired of having to defend my profession because of the actions of a few". Knowing GC, he was/is a top notch, honest, officer of the law. I give him every benefit of a doubt because I know what kind of environment these guys/gals work in. Do they get defensive sometimes? You're damn skippy they do. Maybe fly off a little when they feel they are being scrutinized, though they've done nothing wrong? Yep. Wouldn't we all? When he says he never witnessed such things, I believe him. My husband hasn't witnessed these incidences either, and he's been in law enforcement for 25 yrs.

Every single day, almost without exception, an officer can expect to go in to work defending himself against complaints from the public. Why? Because people that violate laws do not like getting caught, so they call and complain on the officer. The vast majority of these complaints are unfounded, and are nothing more than the "public" blowing off steam about getting busted for something.

Back to the topic- I know there is corruption in law enforcement, but I don't believe it to be as prolific as some would like us to believe. I'll say again, it's the dirty cops that make the job harder. They cause this "let's put the whole profession under a microscope" mentality.

I understand, but to "defend" because it is "your profession" and that is the only reason, is why the public gets annoyed.
Call a spade a spade.
And despite what we may think Rockmart and Cobb are not the entire country.
Funny isn't it that mei lan mentions this practice is bad in TN and what happened in to my friend happened in TN.
Maybe, just maybe, they are doing wrong in TN.

I agree that Rockmart & Cobb are not the entire country. I'm just responding from my corner of the country, using the knowledge I have of two seasoned police officers.

I know several officers I'd consider corrupt (for various reasons). Well, make that former officers. They were terminated for reasons other than what I know of them. No matter, they're no longer in law enforcement and I'm glad of it.

Officers are held to a higher standard because the enforce the law, which causes anything amiss to become a huge news story. Most are proud of their profession, and don't like it when their own integrity comes into question (due to these news stories stirring up public opinion) because of the acts of another.

They are held to a higher standard because we give them the right and power to take someone's liberty away and perhaps their life.
No one that I have seen is questioning any LE officer's integrity in Cobb or Rockmart.
And when someone on this board says, I know this happened and I know the person it happened to and here is the story, and someone else says, well I just don't believe that happened that way because I've never seen it happen.
Then what you are saying is that you think you know more about the situation than the person who is relating the story knows.
That is nothing but hubris and ego and a lack of respect for the person telling the story.

And if they say, well, they must have been involved for that to happen, then why can't "our" brotherhood come into play.
If someone can say, I know these people and they wouldn't do that, then why can't others use the same argument?
I am all for "brotherhood" and "one of the family", but two things must be realized.
One, when you use those terms, you exclude others, others that may feel just as strongly or even more so.
Two, if others can use those terms to defend someone, then why isn't it just as valid when others say the same thing about their "family" or "brotherhood" people?

If you read what I have posted in this thread, from the start of the thread and not just a few of my last posts, I think you will get a better picture and understanding of where I am coming from.

 

[deewee]

I understand GC's response. I'm sure it came from a place of "I get so tired of having to defend my profession because of the actions of a few". Knowing GC, he was/is a top notch, honest, officer of the law. I give him every benefit of a doubt because I know what kind of environment these guys/gals work in. Do they get defensive sometimes? You're damn skippy they do. Maybe fly off a little when they feel they are being scrutinized, though they've done nothing wrong? Yep. Wouldn't we all? When he says he never witnessed such things, I believe him. My husband hasn't witnessed these incidences either, and he's been in law enforcement for 25 yrs.

Every single day, almost without exception, an officer can expect to go in to work defending himself against complaints from the public. Why? Because people that violate laws do not like getting caught, so they call and complain on the officer. The vast majority of these complaints are unfounded, and are nothing more than the "public" blowing off steam about getting busted for something.

Back to the topic- I know there is corruption in law enforcement, but I don't believe it to be as prolific as some would like us to believe. I'll say again, it's the dirty cops that make the job harder. They cause this "let's put the whole profession under a microscope" mentality.

I understand, but to "defend" because it is "your profession" and that is the only reason, is why the public gets annoyed.
Call a spade a spade.
And despite what we may think Rockmart and Cobb are not the entire country.
Funny isn't it that mei lan mentions this practice is bad in TN and what happened in to my friend happened in TN.
Maybe, just maybe, they are doing wrong in TN.

I agree that Rockmart & Cobb are not the entire country. I'm just responding from my corner of the country, using the knowledge I have of two seasoned police officers.

I know several officers I'd consider corrupt (for various reasons). Well, make that former officers. They were terminated for reasons other than what I know of them. No matter, they're no longer in law enforcement and I'm glad of it.

Officers are held to a higher standard because the enforce the law, which causes anything amiss to become a huge news story. Most are proud of their profession, and don't like it when their own integrity comes into question (due to these news stories stirring up public opinion) because of the acts of another.

They are held to a higher standard because we give them the right and power to take someone's liberty away and perhaps their life.
No one that I have seen is questioning any LE officer's integrity in Cobb or Rockmart.
And when someone on this board says, I know this happened and I know the person it happened to and here is the story, and someone else says, well I just don't believe that happened that way because I've never seen it happen.
Then what you are saying is that you think you know more about the situation than the person who is relating the story knows.
That is nothing but hubris and ego and a lack of respect for the person telling the story.

And if they say, well, they must have been involved for that to happen, then why can't "our" brotherhood come into play.
If someone can say, I know these people and they wouldn't do that, then why can't others use the same argument?
I am all for "brotherhood" and "one of the family", but two things must be realized.
One, when you use those terms, you exclude others, others that may feel just as strongly or even more so.
Two, if others can use those terms to defend someone, then why isn't it just as valid when others say the same thing about their "family" or "brotherhood" people?

If you read what I have posted in this thread, from the start of the thread and not just a few of my last posts, I think you will get a better picture and understanding of where I am coming from.

The statement of "I've never seen it happen" does NOT indicate that one knows more than anyone else. It simply means that one does not have any first hand knowledge of this.

I've not said anything about the situation you know about. I didn't dispute the story at all, because I have no knowledge of it.

I am not sticking up for GC because he's a police officer. I'm doing it because I know the man.

 

[Grey Colson]

People need to be more upset with the IRS. Whereas the odds are in your favor of not having your money seized by the mean 'ol popo, the scum at the IRS rape us every pay period at the point of a gun.

While I agree with your point about the IRS, but your answer is like those who when caught doing wrong say, "Yeh, but I only did a little wrong, look at those guys, they do a lot wrong.", instead of, "Yep, I was wrong."
Or, why stop me for speeding? That red car was going twice as fast as I was.
(sound familiar?)

Sorry, but I don't take responsibility for something that I have neither done or witnessed being done. No more than I apologize for slavery or anything else I have not been involved in. :dunno

And thus the reason cops get a bad name.

That response does not make sense.

It makes as much sense as your response to my post.

No one asked you to apologize for anything, much less slavery.
I was making the point that your answer of get mad at the IRS because the IRS steals a crap pot lot of money and not some cops stealing your money to use for their department is no different than me speeding but saying don't give me a ticket, there are people committing worse crimes.

Also, I presume you read my example of someone I personally know who had their truck seized under this law and have chosen not to address it because, a) it doesn't fit your agenda, b) you feel that the person probably had something to do with the illegal activity and deserved it, but do not wish to say that, c) LE never makes a mistake, d) all of the above.

My point is this, one of the things that whizzes the average Joe Blow off, is when there is pretty good evidence that LE is over stepping their bounds and someone who is, or was, a part of LE refuses to acknowledge that it is highly possible that LE has made a mistake.
In other words, that BS of the "brotherhood", the "blue line", which is just another way of saying, we don't admit to doing anything wrong because we belong to the same "club".
Hell, we all belong to one "club" or the other, but I don't ignore or refuse to admit that someone in my "club" did wrong when presented by stories or facts that they did, just because we are brothers.
And I'll tell you something else about my "club", I can promise we have buried more of our brothers and sisters in our "club" than you have in yours.
So life and death as an outcome is not the exclusive domain of your "club".

Just be human and say something like, "if what is reported is true, this is a problem, while I have never personally seen it or know someone who has seen it, but it could happen".

Just like the cops in New Orleans that were one of the biggest murder/robber gangs in the state at one time.
Heck they were doing contract killings, on duty, in uniform and driving patrol cars.

These "bad" cops do not reflect the majority of LE by any means, but they do exist and there are abuses of power and to not acknowledge it is wrong.
I myself have heard you say, I will start looking for things to give them a ticket for if they make me mad.
That is understandable from the human standpoint, but as a professional, it is flat out wrong.

Maybe there is something you should admit. That is, other than this forum you know absolutely zero about me. I do not have to defend myself or anyone else in my profession, but I have a question for you.

How many cops have you arrested and prosecuted?

I'll tell you how many I have. 6

How many have you built a case on and had them either fired or suspended?

I'll tell you how many I have. 100+ ( Accurate number not available because I no longer have access to IA files)

So, in short, don't preach to me about bad cops, turning a blind eye or protecting the club.

I've got YOU ALL beat in actually doing something about bad cops, other than griping about them. So THERE!

Look, there's something I accepted a LONG time ago. People who don't like cops are never going to change their minds, no more than you can convince Billy Graham to join the church of satan. Those people actively search for stories about bad cops. That's cool with me. That's their problem, not mine. I sleep very well knowing the details of my career. I won't apologize for it, I won't hide it and will never regret my past actions.

Live Long and prosper as Spock would say

 

[stradial]

People need to be more upset with the IRS. Whereas the odds are in your favor of not having your money seized by the mean 'ol popo, the scum at the IRS rape us every pay period at the point of a gun.

While I agree with your point about the IRS, but your answer is like those who when caught doing wrong say, "Yeh, but I only did a little wrong, look at those guys, they do a lot wrong.", instead of, "Yep, I was wrong."
Or, why stop me for speeding? That red car was going twice as fast as I was.
(sound familiar?)

Sorry, but I don't take responsibility for something that I have neither done or witnessed being done. No more than I apologize for slavery or anything else I have not been involved in. :dunno

And thus the reason cops get a bad name.

That response does not make sense.

It makes as much sense as your response to my post.

No one asked you to apologize for anything, much less slavery.
I was making the point that your answer of get mad at the IRS because the IRS steals a crap pot lot of money and not some cops stealing your money to use for their department is no different than me speeding but saying don't give me a ticket, there are people committing worse crimes.

Also, I presume you read my example of someone I personally know who had their truck seized under this law and have chosen not to address it because, a) it doesn't fit your agenda, b) you feel that the person probably had something to do with the illegal activity and deserved it, but do not wish to say that, c) LE never makes a mistake, d) all of the above.

My point is this, one of the things that whizzes the average Joe Blow off, is when there is pretty good evidence that LE is over stepping their bounds and someone who is, or was, a part of LE refuses to acknowledge that it is highly possible that LE has made a mistake.
In other words, that BS of the "brotherhood", the "blue line", which is just another way of saying, we don't admit to doing anything wrong because we belong to the same "club".
Hell, we all belong to one "club" or the other, but I don't ignore or refuse to admit that someone in my "club" did wrong when presented by stories or facts that they did, just because we are brothers.
And I'll tell you something else about my "club", I can promise we have buried more of our brothers and sisters in our "club" than you have in yours.
So life and death as an outcome is not the exclusive domain of your "club".

Just be human and say something like, "if what is reported is true, this is a problem, while I have never personally seen it or know someone who has seen it, but it could happen".

Just like the cops in New Orleans that were one of the biggest murder/robber gangs in the state at one time.
Heck they were doing contract killings, on duty, in uniform and driving patrol cars.

These "bad" cops do not reflect the majority of LE by any means, but they do exist and there are abuses of power and to not acknowledge it is wrong.
I myself have heard you say, I will start looking for things to give them a ticket for if they make me mad.
That is understandable from the human standpoint, but as a professional, it is flat out wrong.

Maybe there is something you should admit. That is, other than this forum you know absolutely zero about me. I do not have to defend myself or anyone else in my profession, but I have a question for you.

How many cops have you arrested and prosecuted?

I'll tell you how many I have. 6

How many have you built a case on and had them either fired or suspended?

I'll tell you how many I have. 100+ ( Accurate number not available because I no longer have access to IA files)

So, in short, don't preach to me about bad cops, turning a blind eye or protecting the club.

I've got YOU ALL beat in actually doing something about bad cops, other than griping about them. So THERE!

Look, there's something I accepted a LONG time ago. People who don't like cops are never going to change their minds, no more than you can convince Billy Graham to join the church of satan. Those people actively search for stories about bad cops. That's cool with me. That's their problem, not mine. I sleep very well knowing the details of my career. I won't apologize for it, I won't hide it and will never regret my past actions.

Live Long and prosper as Spock would say

Three points.
1. You know nothing about me either
2. Your comments about people who don't like cops shows me that you have chosen to not take the time, energy or inclination to try and learn anything about me or my opinion on things either. If you had bothered to even read my posts in the thread, with anything like an objective eye, you would have never came away saying anything about my not liking cops.
You might have came away with the idea that I don't like arrogant, ego driven, "I am always right" people, but that is it.
3. I am not surprised that you have only prosecuted 6 cops, I have long felt that when it came to applying the laws to the people you work with, you were probably not as stringent and that is based on what you have said.

One last point, nothing, I repeat nothing, I have said is anything that has not been said to you be several people many times here.
If I had several different people telling me the same thing, then I might wish to take a look at my behavior.
I am fully away that you either won't or can't, but it is suggestion.

BTW, and I stand by my statement, and thus why cops get a bad name.
(and that could go for church goes also)
(oh and rent a sense of humor and see if you like it, you need one)

If anyone thinks this post is harsh, please note that I have toned it down 100%.

 

[Grey Colson]

I shall end my portion of this...whatever it is with....Bless your heart, Brother and put all your $25.00 on red

 

[mei lan]

I would like to say for the record that we are not talking about not liking law enforcement, saying all LE types are bad/corrupt, blah blah blah. We are saying that this practice of civil forfeiture (as it applies to traffic stops where the LE seizes cash not proven to be involved in a crime) is apparently treated as legal, and we don't think it is constitutional.

Winchester apparently thinks that all media always lies.

GC and deewee apparently think that any questioning of LE means that we think that all LE types are evil.

WE GET IT. WE ARE BACKERS OF LE. WE ARE ON YOUR SIDE. We are not the enemy.

What we are saying is that in this society, LE has come to be a little quick on the trigger (so to speak) of assuming the worst of people who have done nothing wrong. If citizens are never allowed to question those in authority, then we may as well live in Cuba.

Just because lawyers and used car salesmen and realtors have a bad name doesn't mean we don't think there are good ones and that we need them sometimes. And the good people in those areas are used to people thinking that and they roll with it.

As I said, we know that every single time an LEO leaves his/her home, they don't know if they will be returning. We know they deal with the scum of the earth every day and that they get sick of it. BUT WE ARE NOT THE ENEMY. We're just looking for an honest discussion of something we view as wrong.

 

[ShoeDiva]

I would like to say for the record that we are not talking about not liking law enforcement, saying all LE types are bad/corrupt, blah blah blah. We are saying that this practice of civil forfeiture (as it applies to traffic stops where the LE seizes cash not proven to be involved in a crime) is apparently treated as legal, and we don't think it is constitutional.

Winchester apparently thinks that all media always lies.

GC and deewee apparently think that any questioning of LE means that we think that all LE types are evil.

WE GET IT. WE ARE BACKERS OF LE. WE ARE ON YOUR SIDE. We are not the enemy.

What we are saying is that in this society, LE has come to be a little quick on the trigger (so to speak) of assuming the worst of people who have done nothing wrong. If citizens are never allowed to question those in authority, then we may as well live in Cuba.

Just because lawyers and used car salesmen and realtors have a bad name doesn't mean we don't think there are good ones and that we need them sometimes. And the good people in those areas are used to people thinking that and they roll with it.

As I said, we know that every single time an LEO leaves his/her home, they don't know if they will be returning. We know they deal with the scum of the earth every day and that they get sick of it. BUT WE ARE NOT THE ENEMY. We're just looking for an honest discussion of something we view as wrong.

Great post.

 

[mei lan]

I would like to say for the record that we are not talking about not liking law enforcement, saying all LE types are bad/corrupt, blah blah blah. We are saying that this practice of civil forfeiture (as it applies to traffic stops where the LE seizes cash not proven to be involved in a crime) is apparently treated as legal, and we don't think it is constitutional.

Winchester apparently thinks that all media always lies.

GC and deewee apparently think that any questioning of LE means that we think that all LE types are evil.

WE GET IT. WE ARE BACKERS OF LE. WE ARE ON YOUR SIDE. We are not the enemy.

What we are saying is that in this society, LE has come to be a little quick on the trigger (so to speak) of assuming the worst of people who have done nothing wrong. If citizens are never allowed to question those in authority, then we may as well live in Cuba.

Just because lawyers and used car salesmen and realtors have a bad name doesn't mean we don't think there are good ones and that we need them sometimes. And the good people in those areas are used to people thinking that and they roll with it.

As I said, we know that every single time an LEO leaves his/her home, they don't know if they will be returning. We know they deal with the scum of the earth every day and that they get sick of it. BUT WE ARE NOT THE ENEMY. We're just looking for an honest discussion of something we view as wrong.

Great post.

Thank you. I restrained myself. I'm a little irked.

 

[ShoeDiva]

I would like to say for the record that we are not talking about not liking law enforcement, saying all LE types are bad/corrupt, blah blah blah. We are saying that this practice of civil forfeiture (as it applies to traffic stops where the LE seizes cash not proven to be involved in a crime) is apparently treated as legal, and we don't think it is constitutional.

Winchester apparently thinks that all media always lies.

GC and deewee apparently think that any questioning of LE means that we think that all LE types are evil.

WE GET IT. WE ARE BACKERS OF LE. WE ARE ON YOUR SIDE. We are not the enemy.

What we are saying is that in this society, LE has come to be a little quick on the trigger (so to speak) of assuming the worst of people who have done nothing wrong. If citizens are never allowed to question those in authority, then we may as well live in Cuba.

Just because lawyers and used car salesmen and realtors have a bad name doesn't mean we don't think there are good ones and that we need them sometimes. And the good people in those areas are used to people thinking that and they roll with it.

As I said, we know that every single time an LEO leaves his/her home, they don't know if they will be returning. We know they deal with the scum of the earth every day and that they get sick of it. BUT WE ARE NOT THE ENEMY. We're just looking for an honest discussion of something we view as wrong.

Great post.

Thank you. I restrained myself. I'm a little irked.

:hug

 

[Grey Colson]

I would like to say for the record that we are not talking about not liking law enforcement, saying all LE types are bad/corrupt, blah blah blah. We are saying that this practice of civil forfeiture (as it applies to traffic stops where the LE seizes cash not proven to be involved in a crime) is apparently treated as legal, and we don't think it is constitutional.

Winchester apparently thinks that all media always lies.

GC and deewee apparently think that any questioning of LE means that we think that all LE types are evil.

WE GET IT. WE ARE BACKERS OF LE. WE ARE ON YOUR SIDE. We are not the enemy.

What we are saying is that in this society, LE has come to be a little quick on the trigger (so to speak) of assuming the worst of people who have done nothing wrong. If citizens are never allowed to question those in authority, then we may as well live in Cuba.

Just because lawyers and used car salesmen and realtors have a bad name doesn't mean we don't think there are good ones and that we need them sometimes. And the good people in those areas are used to people thinking that and they roll with it.

As I said, we know that every single time an LEO leaves his/her home, they don't know if they will be returning. We know they deal with the scum of the earth every day and that they get sick of it. BUT WE ARE NOT THE ENEMY. We're just looking for an honest discussion of something we view as wrong.

And all I was trying to say....and did say from the beginning is that I have never, EVER seen or heard of a case (until these claims were posted) in which a person's money was seized just because they "might" be using it in a criminal interprise or recent crime.

Sure I've seized money, but it was always subsequent to a drug arrest and clearly the money was involved. Every, single time. I'm not saying it has not happened, but I have not witnessed it. I'm not defending a practice that I know nothing about. But to read these heated posts, you would believe the practice is wide spread and occurred on a daily basis. AND as heated as some of these remarks have been, you would also believe it was happening to the membership on this board.

I mean, c'mon people. No I don't think everyone hates LE. No I don't want a pat on the back. I never took the job to "Lord" over people. I didn't have a job at the time that would pay the bills and at 6.06 per hour, it barely did then.

If anyone would care to notice, I think LTD, I could be mistaken, posted about some other LE issue recently that I agreed was totally bad judgement on the side of the police. I just will not condemn the actions of LE out of hand just because someone was told by someone's brother that such and such happened to them, especially when I know nothing about it. It's that simple.

 

[Guard Dad]

I received a complaint on this thread. Just wanted to remind everyone that as we debate and even disagree, please try and be respectful to each other.

Thank you

 

[mei lan]

I would like to say for the record that we are not talking about not liking law enforcement, saying all LE types are bad/corrupt, blah blah blah. We are saying that this practice of civil forfeiture (as it applies to traffic stops where the LE seizes cash not proven to be involved in a crime) is apparently treated as legal, and we don't think it is constitutional.

Winchester apparently thinks that all media always lies.

GC and deewee apparently think that any questioning of LE means that we think that all LE types are evil.

WE GET IT. WE ARE BACKERS OF LE. WE ARE ON YOUR SIDE. We are not the enemy.

What we are saying is that in this society, LE has come to be a little quick on the trigger (so to speak) of assuming the worst of people who have done nothing wrong. If citizens are never allowed to question those in authority, then we may as well live in Cuba.

Just because lawyers and used car salesmen and realtors have a bad name doesn't mean we don't think there are good ones and that we need them sometimes. And the good people in those areas are used to people thinking that and they roll with it.

As I said, we know that every single time an LEO leaves his/her home, they don't know if they will be returning. We know they deal with the scum of the earth every day and that they get sick of it. BUT WE ARE NOT THE ENEMY. We're just looking for an honest discussion of something we view as wrong.

And all I was trying to say....and did say from the beginning is that I have never, EVER seen or heard of a case (until these claims were posted) in which a person's money was seized just because they "might" be using it in a criminal interprise or recent crime.

Sure I've seized money, but it was always subsequent to a drug arrest and clearly the money was involved. Every, single time. I'm not saying it has not happened, but I have not witnessed it. I'm not defending a practice that I know nothing about. But to read these heated posts, you would believe the practice is wide spread and occurred on a daily basis. AND as heated as some of these remarks have been, you would also believe it was happening to the membership on this board.

I mean, c'mon people. No I don't think everyone hates LE. No I don't want a pat on the back. I never took the job to "Lord" over people. I didn't have a job at the time that would pay the bills and at 6.06 per hour, it barely did then.

If anyone would care to notice, I think LTD, I could be mistaken, posted about some other LE issue recently that I agreed was totally bad judgement on the side of the police. I just will not condemn the actions of LE out of hand just because someone was told by someone's brother that such and such happened to them, especially when I know nothing about it. It's that simple.

As I said to Winchester, that's not what we're talking about. We get that most LE types don't do this or whatever. But in some jurisdictions, there is documented proof that it does happen.

This is a nation of 310,000,000 people. If 1% are stopped by LE in a given year, that's 3,100,000. If 1/2 of 1% of that 3,100,000 have cash that is seized by an LE without an arrest during a traffic stop, that is 15,500 people who have cash taken away from them without foundation and the onus is on them to get it back.

I have no idea what the real figures are, but even if it were just 100 people in a year - what we're saying is it's not constitutional, and we would like some discussion of it, instead of railings about all media being liars and all questioning of LE being out of line.

If you have no opinion, that's fine. I just thought it would be a decent discussion to have among (mostly) conservatives since it's a hot topic amongst liberals these days.

 

[Guard Dad]

OK, to expand a bit....these cop thread tend to get tense because there are many of us (myself included) who have been abused by police, and there are also LEO/former LEO/LEO spouses here who might take things too personally.

I think we can all agree that there are SOME bad cops out there, same as there are bad apples in every bunch. But we should be careful to use a narrow brush when painting them, and those on the other side might try to not take remarks about the bad cops personally. I am quite sure that the LEO family here do not fall into the bad cop category.

Soooo, anyone want to see a pic of my butt?

 

[mei lan]

Nah, I'm good. But thanks for askin'. :Stick