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Genevieve
Guest
I'd be interested in what happened to the priest as well. Maybe we could show you whether or not the portrayal was realistic.ShoeDiva said:
Can you lose it?
- Thread starter LisaC
- Start date
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Genevieve
Guest
Thanks!! :hugShoeDiva said:Genevieve said:
Gen so glad you are back.
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Genevieve
Guest
I believe that a person may encounter a vision of Jesus in his death agony and receive and return His love--like the good thief on the cross. But...right...it's nothing an earthling could possibly discern by observation.ShoeDiva said:
LisaC
I'm here to spin the moral compass.
Guard Dad said:
For the sake of this topic, I am assuming that they have sought salvation and received it. I'm not questioning that. I just know that some Christians believe that salvation can be lost and other believe that once you have it, you have it.
ShoeDiva said:
You can't use proper capitalization on it either. :taunt
Been years since I saw the movie, so it's fuzzy. The character was a priest of some sorts; after the rapture he found himself left behind on Earth and realized that he had never truly given himself to Christ. I think he used some language that maybe he had just been "playing church" all this time, going through the motions but had never given himself over.
As Gen mentioned, none of us will truly know for sure until the day comes. The human mind can be pretty good at fooling itself.
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Genevieve
Guest
Well, okay. That would certainly be possible for a priest, just like anyone else.
We don't know our own hearts to be sure, and Our Lord Himself said that there would be those who say to Him, "Lord, Lord..." to whom He is going to respond, "Away from Me. I never knew you." That is a prospect with which we must all grapple.
Blazing Saddles
Pursuit Driver
Nope. Can't lose it. Paul says were justified. (Past tense) it's already done. Paul clearly states that we are to have assurance of our salvation. God never intended us to walk in faith with uncertainty of our future.
How tragic it would be if we went through life thinking we were saved and then woke up on Judgment Day to find out we were mistaken! But the Bible teaches that this will be the case with many people. Christ said, "Many will say unto Me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Thy name? and in Thy name have cast out devils? and in Thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from Me, ye that work iniquity" (Matt.7:22-23).However, we do not have to go through life without the assurance of salvation. In 1 John 5:13 the apostle says, "These things have I written unto you...that ye may know that ye have eternal life." How then can we have this assurance? This is the most important question we will ever face in life because our eternal destiny is at stake! The Bible teaches that those who remain unsaved will spend eternity in a place of perpetual torment (Matt. 25:46; Rev. 14:9-11). The reason for this is because their sin has not been paid for, and God's perfect justice requires that payment be made for sin (Rom. 6:23). Therefore, it is vital that we know the answer to this question. This is why the Apostle Peter wrote, "Give diligence to make your calling and election sure" (2 Pet. 1:10).It is true that we must believe in Christ in order to become saved (Acts 16:31), but how can we be sure we have genuinely believed in Him? Certainly we cannot rely upon our feelings since feelings can be misleading. Some might suggest we can be sure by acknowledging the facts of the gospel or saying the sinner's prayer. However, the Bible indicates it is not possible to believe without being regenerated because by nature we are spiritually dead (Eph. 2:1 cf. 1 Cor. 2:14). This is why Christ said, "Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God" (John 3:3). Therefore, we cannot know we have truly believed until we know we are born again.But what does it mean to be born again? Is this some kind of emotional experience? No, the Bible teaches that being born again means our life is changed. In 2 Corinthians 5:17 we read, "Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature; old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new." The Bible also tells us what changes will take place in our life when we are born again.First, we will not habitually commit sin."Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin."—1 John 3:9"How shall we that are dead to sin live any longer therein?"—Romans 6:2"Religion, in the spring of it, is not an art, an acquired dexterity and skill, but a new nature. And thereupon the consequence is the regenerate person cannot sin. That he cannot commit an act of sin, I suppose no judicious interpreter understands. This would be contrary to 1 John. 1:9, where it is made our duty to confess our sins, and supposed that our privilege thereupon is to have our sins forgiven. He therefore cannot sin, in the sense in which the apostle says, he cannot commit sin. He cannot continue in the course and practice of sin. He cannot so sin as to denominate him a sinner in opposition to a saint or servant of God."—Matthew Henry's Commentary on the Whole Bible, Volume VISecond, we will seek to live a holy life by obeying God's Word."Everyone that doeth righteousness is born of Him."—1 John 2:29"And hereby do we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments."—1 John 2:3"Where the righteousness of Christ is imputed to an individual, a principle of holiness is imparted to him; the former can only be ascertained by the latter. It is impossible to obtain a Scriptural knowledge that the merits of Christ’s finished work are reckoned to my account, except by proving that the efficacy of the Holy Spirit’s work is evident in my soul."—Arthur W. PinkThird, we will love others, regardless of who they are or what they have done."Everyone that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God. He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love."—1 John 4:7-8"We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren."—1 John 3:14"All the fruits of the Spirit which we are to lay weight upon as evidential of grace, are summed up in charity, or Christian love; because this is the sum of all grace. And the only way, therefore, in which any can know their good estate, is by discerning the exercises of this divine charity in their hearts; for without charity, let men have what gifts you please, they are nothing."—Jonathan EdwardsFourth, our affections will not be upon the things of the world."If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him."—1 John 2:15"For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit...But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His."—Romans. 8:5, 9"If our principal treasure be as we profess, in things spiritual and heavenly, and woe unto us if it be not so! on them will our affections, and consequently our desires and thoughts, be principally fixed."—John OwenThese changes are not the cause of our salvation for we are saved by faith (Eph. 2:8-9). But rather, they are the evidence that we truly have been born again. If they have not taken place in our life, then it is vital that we earnestly seek God and implore Him to regenerate us. He promises we will find Him if we seek Him with all our heart (Deut. 4:29), and the way to begin is by reading His Word. The Bible says, "So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the Word of God" (Rom. 10:17).
http://www.spurgeongems.org/assurance.htm
How tragic it would be if we went through life thinking we were saved and then woke up on Judgment Day to find out we were mistaken! But the Bible teaches that this will be the case with many people. Christ said, "Many will say unto Me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Thy name? and in Thy name have cast out devils? and in Thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from Me, ye that work iniquity" (Matt.7:22-23).However, we do not have to go through life without the assurance of salvation. In 1 John 5:13 the apostle says, "These things have I written unto you...that ye may know that ye have eternal life." How then can we have this assurance? This is the most important question we will ever face in life because our eternal destiny is at stake! The Bible teaches that those who remain unsaved will spend eternity in a place of perpetual torment (Matt. 25:46; Rev. 14:9-11). The reason for this is because their sin has not been paid for, and God's perfect justice requires that payment be made for sin (Rom. 6:23). Therefore, it is vital that we know the answer to this question. This is why the Apostle Peter wrote, "Give diligence to make your calling and election sure" (2 Pet. 1:10).It is true that we must believe in Christ in order to become saved (Acts 16:31), but how can we be sure we have genuinely believed in Him? Certainly we cannot rely upon our feelings since feelings can be misleading. Some might suggest we can be sure by acknowledging the facts of the gospel or saying the sinner's prayer. However, the Bible indicates it is not possible to believe without being regenerated because by nature we are spiritually dead (Eph. 2:1 cf. 1 Cor. 2:14). This is why Christ said, "Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God" (John 3:3). Therefore, we cannot know we have truly believed until we know we are born again.But what does it mean to be born again? Is this some kind of emotional experience? No, the Bible teaches that being born again means our life is changed. In 2 Corinthians 5:17 we read, "Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature; old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new." The Bible also tells us what changes will take place in our life when we are born again.First, we will not habitually commit sin."Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin."—1 John 3:9"How shall we that are dead to sin live any longer therein?"—Romans 6:2"Religion, in the spring of it, is not an art, an acquired dexterity and skill, but a new nature. And thereupon the consequence is the regenerate person cannot sin. That he cannot commit an act of sin, I suppose no judicious interpreter understands. This would be contrary to 1 John. 1:9, where it is made our duty to confess our sins, and supposed that our privilege thereupon is to have our sins forgiven. He therefore cannot sin, in the sense in which the apostle says, he cannot commit sin. He cannot continue in the course and practice of sin. He cannot so sin as to denominate him a sinner in opposition to a saint or servant of God."—Matthew Henry's Commentary on the Whole Bible, Volume VISecond, we will seek to live a holy life by obeying God's Word."Everyone that doeth righteousness is born of Him."—1 John 2:29"And hereby do we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments."—1 John 2:3"Where the righteousness of Christ is imputed to an individual, a principle of holiness is imparted to him; the former can only be ascertained by the latter. It is impossible to obtain a Scriptural knowledge that the merits of Christ’s finished work are reckoned to my account, except by proving that the efficacy of the Holy Spirit’s work is evident in my soul."—Arthur W. PinkThird, we will love others, regardless of who they are or what they have done."Everyone that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God. He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love."—1 John 4:7-8"We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren."—1 John 3:14"All the fruits of the Spirit which we are to lay weight upon as evidential of grace, are summed up in charity, or Christian love; because this is the sum of all grace. And the only way, therefore, in which any can know their good estate, is by discerning the exercises of this divine charity in their hearts; for without charity, let men have what gifts you please, they are nothing."—Jonathan EdwardsFourth, our affections will not be upon the things of the world."If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him."—1 John 2:15"For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit...But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His."—Romans. 8:5, 9"If our principal treasure be as we profess, in things spiritual and heavenly, and woe unto us if it be not so! on them will our affections, and consequently our desires and thoughts, be principally fixed."—John OwenThese changes are not the cause of our salvation for we are saved by faith (Eph. 2:8-9). But rather, they are the evidence that we truly have been born again. If they have not taken place in our life, then it is vital that we earnestly seek God and implore Him to regenerate us. He promises we will find Him if we seek Him with all our heart (Deut. 4:29), and the way to begin is by reading His Word. The Bible says, "So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the Word of God" (Rom. 10:17).
http://www.spurgeongems.org/assurance.htm
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Genevieve
Guest
:agreed ...and don't just throw Spurgeon at us! You read it and give us the good stuff. I do the same for you.Madea said:Dude! Use paragraphs.
Blazing Saddles
Pursuit Driver
That's all you guys can come up with? Obviously you can't read this driving but it isn't took hard. Maybe I'll added a few pictures next time. I'm on vacation and thought enough of all of you to give my input and a great theologian who puts it into simple terms we all can benefit from. 8)
Blazing Saddles
Pursuit Driver
Re: Re: Can you lose it?
Maybe I should have posted pictures for the simple minded.....)))
When I get back home. I'll be sure to give you my reasoning as well with biblical evidence. Spurgeon made it easy here at the beach.
uh, hello? I gave you mine as well.LisaC said:
Maybe I should have posted pictures for the simple minded.....
)))When I get back home. I'll be sure to give you my reasoning as well with biblical evidence. Spurgeon made it easy here at the beach.
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Genevieve
Guest
Dude! I could cut and paste Humanae Vitae, but I don't because I figure you could Google that for yourself. I give you *my* take on it, in my own words because we are human beings having a conversation. I do the work on my point of view and present it. You need to step up to the plate do the work on your point of view. I don't have time to invest in Spurgeon!Blazing Saddles said:
LisaC
I'm here to spin the moral compass.
Re: Re: Can you lose it?
Simple minded? BOY, keep going and we might find out if your salvation will get you into heaven a little sooner than you might have expected...
:Stick
As for your comments, I read them, but by the time I got through with Spurgeon treatise, I couldn't remember if you made a personal comment or not...
Blazing Saddles said:uh, hello? I gave you mine as well.LisaC said:
Maybe I should have posted pictures for the simple minded.....
Simple minded? BOY, keep going and we might find out if your salvation will get you into heaven a little sooner than you might have expected...
:Stick
As for your comments, I read them, but by the time I got through with Spurgeon treatise, I couldn't remember if you made a personal comment or not...