Can you lose it?

[mei lan]

But how would you explain Matthew 24:12-13 "Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved." If the one who stands firm to the end will be saved, what about the one whose love grows cold and who does not stand firm to the end? Do you believe that he also is saved?

Also, in the parable of the sower, Jesus explains that some receive the word with joy but then either Satan, or the cares of this world, or persecution thwart their growth, and they wither and die. Do you believe they receive eternal life even though Our Lord describes them as withered and dead?

My personal opinion is that their faith was never real. God disciplines His own, so if they were truly believers, He would work towards bringing them back into the fold.

 

[Genevieve]

But how would you explain Matthew 24:12-13 "Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved." If the one who stands firm to the end will be saved, what about the one whose love grows cold and who does not stand firm to the end? Do you believe that he also is saved?

Also, in the parable of the sower, Jesus explains that some receive the word with joy but then either Satan, or the cares of this world, or persecution thwart their growth, and they wither and die. Do you believe they receive eternal life even though Our Lord describes them as withered and dead?

My personal opinion is that their faith was never real. God disciplines His own, so if they were truly believers, He would work towards bringing them back into the fold.

Well...agreeing to disagree. :hug

 

[deewee]

I started reading all the responses, then quit.

Two things:

1- I know I am saved because the Oly Spirit lives in me. I am sealed by that Holy Spirit, of that I am sure. I know it by the power of the Holy Spirit operating in my life, changing me daily to become more like Him. That does not happen without the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. I know because the spirit within me bears witness to it. I know it because of who I am today vs who I was before salvation.

2- There are many people that claim to be Christian but have never been saved. The "lie" isn't so much to be telling a lie, but to fit in with Christians. Sometimes people say that to try to gain favored opinion of themselves with another person, but in fact they've never asked for the saving grace that can only come thru Jesus. They go thru the motions and try to be "good" in front of others, yet they've never laid their own pride down and sincerely asked Jesus into their heart.

 

[mei lan]

1- I know I am saved because the Oly Spirit lives in me.

Hmmm...is this a Scandinavian name for God? Or perhaps the Olay God who provides Oil of Olay to believers?

 

[mei lan]

But how would you explain Matthew 24:12-13 "Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved." If the one who stands firm to the end will be saved, what about the one whose love grows cold and who does not stand firm to the end? Do you believe that he also is saved?

Also, in the parable of the sower, Jesus explains that some receive the word with joy but then either Satan, or the cares of this world, or persecution thwart their growth, and they wither and die. Do you believe they receive eternal life even though Our Lord describes them as withered and dead?

My personal opinion is that their faith was never real. God disciplines His own, so if they were truly believers, He would work towards bringing them back into the fold.

Well...agreeing to disagree. :hug

:hug

 

[Genevieve]

I started reading all the responses, then quit.

Two things:

1- I know I am saved because the Oly Spirit lives in me. I am sealed by that Holy Spirit, of that I am sure. I know it by the power of the Holy Spirit operating in my life, changing me daily to become more like Him. That does not happen without the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. I know because the spirit within me bears witness to it. I know it because of who I am today vs who I was before salvation.

2- There are many people that claim to be Christian but have never been saved. The "lie" isn't so much to be telling a lie, but to fit in with Christians. Sometimes people say that to try to gain favored opinion of themselves with another person, but in fact they've never asked for the saving grace that can only come thru Jesus. They go thru the motions and try to be "good" in front of others, yet they've never laid their own pride down and sincerely asked Jesus into their heart.

Those observations are very profound.

For Catholics, the spiritual life is a series of conversions, such as what you describe in the your first statement. And then things may go stale and there is a risk that the second situation can happen, so another conversion is necessary. The three conversions are called purgation, illumination and divine union.

 

[ShoeDiva]

1- I know I am saved because the Oly Spirit lives in me.

Hmmm...is this a Scandinavian name for God? Or perhaps the Olay God who provides Oil of Olay to believers?

:nunfinger













) ) )

 

[mei lan]

Those observations are very profound.

For Catholics, the spiritual life is a series of conversions, such as what you describe in the your first statement. And then things may go stale and there is a risk that the second situation can happen, so another conversion is necessary. The three conversions are called purgation, illumination and divine union.

Speaking of profound...Imma hafta study on that some. I can see where much difference between believers is simply a matter of semantics (although some real differences exist). Thank you for the insight and challenge, G. When I read up on this, I'll ask you some questions.

 

[mei lan]

1- I know I am saved because the Oly Spirit lives in me.

Hmmm...is this a Scandinavian name for God? Or perhaps the Olay God who provides Oil of Olay to believers?

:nunfinger













) ) )

I know. I am evil. :hangingheadinshameandgoingtositincorner:

 

[Genevieve]

Those observations are very profound.

For Catholics, the spiritual life is a series of conversions, such as what you describe in the your first statement. And then things may go stale and there is a risk that the second situation can happen, so another conversion is necessary. The three conversions are called purgation, illumination and divine union.

Speaking of profound...Imma hafta study on that some. I can see where much difference between believers is simply a matter of semantics (although some real differences exist). Thank you for the insight and challenge, G. When I read up on this, I'll ask you some questions.

Hey! I can recommend a cool book on it that our saintly FSSP priest recommended to me. He read it in the seminary and likes it because it is based on the writings of St. Thomas Aquinas. Plus it's cheap and a quick read.

It's called The Three Conversions in the Spiritual Life by Father Reginald Garrigou-LaGrange. http://www.amazon.com/Conversions-Spiritual-Life-Reginald-Garrigou-Lagrange/dp/0895557398

 

[deewee]

1- I know I am saved because the Oly Spirit lives in me.

Hmmm...is this a Scandinavian name for God? Or perhaps the Olay God who provides Oil of Olay to believers?

Hahaha! I didn't catch that! Don't the English pronounce it that way? No, wait, they pronounce it "Oily", according to the Vicar of Dibley. )

 

[mei lan]

1- I know I am saved because the Oly Spirit lives in me.

Hmmm...is this a Scandinavian name for God? Or perhaps the Olay God who provides Oil of Olay to believers?

Hahaha! I didn't catch that! Don't the English pronounce it that way? No, wait, they pronounce it "Oily", according to the Vicar of Dibley. )

That's a little cockney, but yeah.

 

[deewee]

I started reading all the responses, then quit.

Two things:

1- I know I am saved because the Oly Spirit lives in me. I am sealed by that Holy Spirit, of that I am sure. I know it by the power of the Holy Spirit operating in my life, changing me daily to become more like Him. That does not happen without the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. I know because the spirit within me bears witness to it. I know it because of who I am today vs who I was before salvation.

2- There are many people that claim to be Christian but have never been saved. The "lie" isn't so much to be telling a lie, but to fit in with Christians. Sometimes people say that to try to gain favored opinion of themselves with another person, but in fact they've never asked for the saving grace that can only come thru Jesus. They go thru the motions and try to be "good" in front of others, yet they've never laid their own pride down and sincerely asked Jesus into their heart.

Those observations are very profound.

For Catholics, the spiritual life is a series of conversions, such as what you describe in the your first statement. And then things may go stale and there is a risk that the second situation can happen, so another conversion is necessary. The three conversions are called purgation, illumination and divine union.

I've never heard those words, but I'm not Catholic so that's not surprising. I'll do some reading on it when I'm not on my phone.

 

[Genevieve]

I started reading all the responses, then quit.

Two things:

1- I know I am saved because the Oly Spirit lives in me. I am sealed by that Holy Spirit, of that I am sure. I know it by the power of the Holy Spirit operating in my life, changing me daily to become more like Him. That does not happen without the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. I know because the spirit within me bears witness to it. I know it because of who I am today vs who I was before salvation.

2- There are many people that claim to be Christian but have never been saved. The "lie" isn't so much to be telling a lie, but to fit in with Christians. Sometimes people say that to try to gain favored opinion of themselves with another person, but in fact they've never asked for the saving grace that can only come thru Jesus. They go thru the motions and try to be "good" in front of others, yet they've never laid their own pride down and sincerely asked Jesus into their heart.

Those observations are very profound.

For Catholics, the spiritual life is a series of conversions, such as what you describe in the your first statement. And then things may go stale and there is a risk that the second situation can happen, so another conversion is necessary. The three conversions are called purgation, illumination and divine union.

I've never heard those words, but I'm not Catholic so that's not surprising. I'll do some reading on it when I'm not on my phone.

Don't worry. Most Catholics have not heard them, either--only fanatics. But you might also like the book I recommended to Mei Lan.

 

[Genevieve]

1- I know I am saved because the Oly Spirit lives in me.

Hmmm...is this a Scandinavian name for God? Or perhaps the Olay God who provides Oil of Olay to believers?

Hahaha! I didn't catch that! Don't the English pronounce it that way? No, wait, they pronounce it "Oily", according to the Vicar of Dibley. )

That's a little cockney, but yeah.

You capitalized it and everything...

 

[Guard Dad]

I love this! Catholic and Protestant having a great theological discussion and doing in a respectful and loving manner, both seeking a greater understanding of God's word.

There aren't many places this could happen.

 

[Madea]

That's all you guys can come up with? Obviously you can't read this driving but it isn't took hard. Maybe I'll added a few pictures next time. I'm on vacation and thought enough of all of you to give my input and a great theologian who puts it into simple terms we all can benefit from. 8)

My sincere apologies. I didn't intentionally try and start an avalance. Now, back 3 pages to catch up.

 

[Genevieve]

Re: Re: Can you lose it?

That's all you guys can come up with? Obviously you can't read this driving but it isn't took hard. Maybe I'll added a few pictures next time. I'm on vacation and thought enough of all of you to give my input and a great theologian who puts it into simple terms were all can benefit from. 8)

I didn't ask for the input of a great theologian - I asked for YOUR input. You read it and post your thoughts on it. If I wanted to cut and paste Spurgeon, I could have done that two pages ago...

uh, hello? I gave you mine as well.

Maybe I should have posted pictures for the simple minded..... ) ) )

Simple minded? BOY, keep going and we might find out if your salvation will get you into heaven a little sooner than you might have expected...
:Stick


As for your comments, I read them, but by the time I got through with Spurgeon treatise, I couldn't remember if you made a personal comment or not...

I confess, I could not slog through the treatise...

It's Spurgeon's commentary on how to be assured you are saved. If you decide to read it, click on the link - it's much easier to read that way.

You're right. The link is a lot easier to read. Thanks.

 

[Genevieve]

That's all you guys can come up with? Obviously you can't read this driving but it isn't took hard. Maybe I'll added a few pictures next time. I'm on vacation and thought enough of all of you to give my input and a great theologian who puts it into simple terms we all can benefit from. 8)

My sincere apologies. I didn't intentionally try and start an avalance. Now, back 3 pages to catch up.

Mine, too! I used to get into frustrating arguments with people who would cut and paste reams of anti-Catholic garbage that they, themselves, would not even be able to slog through. You didn't do that, but I took my frustration out on you. I'm sorry.

 

[Cheezy]

Yes, once saved, always saved.

I do believe that if someone takes their life, there is more going on than one might believe. So, if God is, indeed, a forgiving God- he understands, forgives and will welcome them.

Oh, and I did not read this whole thread.