A conversation about race

[naturegirl]

Fear can make you think and do some wildly crazy things. So I would make an effort to find out why someone feels the way they do and if I indeed felt strongly enough about it, I'd do what I could to help calm those fears. It's kind of hard to trust labs when one took off part of your ear.

 

[Guard Dad]

Please don't confuse lack of a response with others agreeing with what someone may post in a thread. I find many things posted here disturbing but don't feel a response is necessary or appropriate when someone is expressing their opinion on a topic. This thread is a perfect example of why America cannot hold honest and open discussions on race relations. If we can't even hold one here on the Highway without highly offending each other then how in the world can America as a whole have one without even more outrage. Add in the political agenda of various groups and it adds even more fuel to the fire.

J - I do apologize to you. This isn't directed at anyone who did not respond, but merely to those that did. I am completely open to having a discussion about race relations in this country, but it becomes difficult when comments that should be considered unacceptable are dismissed and, in some cases, defended. If we don't do something to correct that thought process, we are always going to have issues.

Lisa

What actually happened here was that many of us withheld judgement on SG's original post because we felt some of her wording was unfortunate and perhaps it did not accurately reflect her feelings. My feelings from the beginning was that she was venting her frustrations and it just didn't come out quite right. Wish I had a nickle for every time I did that.

After reading her subsequent posts, especially the last one; it appears that this is exactly what happened and that her intent was not as bad as you still seem to think. So we weren't dismissing or defending her original remarks, just cutting the lady some slack until she had a chance to clarify them. And since she did, I am fairly comfortable with her position and the state of her heart.

J-Man is absolutely correct that what happened in this thread makes any real discussion next to impossible. Once we get angry and start lashing out at the other parties, it becomes war and people tend to chose their sides instead of considering different ideas and beliefs. Are we really interested in solving the real issue of racism, or would we rather just fight about it? I'll leave this for you to consider.

 

[Blazing Saddles]

To dive in and throw the yoke of "racist" around someone's neck based upon a post isn't really fair in my book. Perfect example why many people don't want to discuss the subject. Very inappropriate to shroud the topic with a label that is so inflammatory. BTW, being "offended" doesn't warrant an attack from anyone.

 

[I'm Floored]

Please don't confuse lack of a response with others agreeing with what someone may post in a thread. I find many things posted here disturbing but don't feel a response is necessary or appropriate when someone is expressing their opinion on a topic. This thread is a perfect example of why America cannot hold honest and open discussions on race relations. If we can't even hold one here on the Highway without highly offending each other then how in the world can America as a whole have one without even more outrage. Add in the political agenda of various groups and it adds even more fuel to the fire.

J - I do apologize to you. This isn't directed at anyone who did not respond, but merely to those that did. I am completely open to having a discussion about race relations in this country, but it becomes difficult when comments that should be considered unacceptable are dismissed and, in some cases, defended. If we don't do something to correct that thought process, we are always going to have issues.

Huh. Well I responded, so I guess that your post IS directed at me. I did not feel your outrage, but it doesn't mean that I agree. I pointed out that I could understand where she was coming from. Understanding and agreeing are two different things.

And SEPARATISM and RACISM are two different things as well. I certainly don't think SG believes in complete segregation, but again, I think she's speaking to a certain culture rather than a race.

I have a friend who, like me, has a blended family. In our family, we do as much as we can together. My friend....she and her new husband separate the children they have - for age and other reasons. Two are older, and two are younger. They've also had some major issues regarding the children. So when one set is visiting the ex, the other set of children is home with them, and vice versa. It's not something I AGREE with - I certainly wouldn't do it, but I UNDERSTAND why they feel the way they do.

But that's just me. I have a few passions of my own, but I don't go around calling people "racist" (or equivalent insults) just because they don't feel the same way I do.

 

[J-man]

If I held a magic wand I'd wave it over America and make our problems disappear, but this ain't Utopia and I live in the real world. Race relations is only one of our problems and unfortunately, in my opinion, becoming less relevant only because other issues are growing to be a much more immediate threat requiring more attention. It's all written in the Book, the directions are easy to read but many refuse to turn to the page or even open the Book.

 

[LisaC]

Okay, enlighten me. Where exactly does she retract her initial statement or say that I misinterpreted it? Maybe it was in a deleted post? Or a PM? :dunno :dunno :dunno

And, separating a person or group on the basis of race is a form of racism.

 

[Blazing Saddles]

Check this out. Is he racist? I don't think so. I felt uncomfortable just listening to him.

George Zimmerman Stoned Trayvon Martin: Deuteronomy 21 : 18 - 21

 

[stradial]

I am tiptoeing into this thread, again.
(topics like these are like a minefield when there are just typed words to read, one false step and BOOM)
(in person it is easier to get a clearer understanding of what a person means and what they are trying to say)

I think that most people grow up with ideas and beliefs that are put in place by the people and circumstances that surround them.
I have mentioned many times about my mother who is a wonderful, loving, Christian lady.
However, my mother has never had to face much, as they say nowadays, diversity in her personal life. And I do think it makes a difference when it is in your personal life rather than in your business life.

My wife's son married a nice lady who has a black father and a white mother.
I guess this makes her half white and half black.
The son and his wife had two kids, a boy and a girl.
I guess this makes my grandkids a quarter black and three-quarters white.

Now, my mother is the type of person who naturally would consider these her great-grandchildren.
She is also the type, due to how she was raised, to have certain thoughts and perhaps beliefs about "mixed" people.

So here comes into her home a half-n-half step-daughter-in-law along with two "mixed" great-grandkids.
I could see when we (my mother and I) first discussed this situation, before she met the grandkids or their mother, that my mother had some reservations.
But being a good person by nature and being a good christian by choice, she would try and be as open and welcoming as she could be.

It didn't take but a very short time during the first visit that she adjusted and realized that what she was, thinking or fearing or believed or whatever, was not there and she became her "normal" self.

It was a great growing experience for my mother and it gave her a new outlook on "mixed" people and relationships.

By the way, it was only after some family that she loved had divorces, that she changed her thoughts on people who get divorced.

I do not think that my mother is unusual in this way, I think that is the way that most of us learn and grow.

 

[LisaC]

To dive in and throw the yoke of "racist" around someone's neck based upon a post isn't really fair in my book. Perfect example why many people don't want to discuss the subject. Very inappropriate to shroud the topic with a label that is so inflammatory. BTW, being "offended" doesn't warrant an attack from anyone.

Really, I've been attacked throughout this thread so I thought it was okay. :dunno

And, again, in response to Diva's question about whether SG's comments were meant in sarcasm, I believe I said "ingorance." I responded to her comments, I didn't personally attack SG. I also said that in a later post, that was also deleted.

But, as I said, enlighten me, show me where she said that she did not mean what she said. If I'm wrong, I will apologize profusely and publicly.

 

[I'm Floored]

rac·ism [rey-siz-uhm] noun
1. a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one's own race is superior and has the right to rule others.

2. a policy, system of government, etc., based upon or fostering such a doctrine; discrimination.

3. hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.

Why do we separate grade levels? Why do we separate genders in public restrooms? Why do we separate wild and domesticated animals? Is it the same?

The IDEALS behind the separation determine whether or not racism is present, not the act itself.


Again - before I am labeled a racist - these are not solutions in my opinion. But I think a racist label has been thrown around here without foundation. And that's shameful. :girlsaysno

 

[Blazing Saddles]

To dive in and throw the yoke of "racist" around someone's neck based upon a post isn't really fair in my book. Perfect example why many people don't want to discuss the subject. Very inappropriate to shroud the topic with a label that is so inflammatory. BTW, being "offended" doesn't warrant an attack from anyone.

Really, I've been attacked throughout this thread so I thought it was okay. :dunno

And, again, in response to Diva's question about whether SG's comments were meant in sarcasm, I believe I said "ingorance." I responded to her comments, I didn't personally attack SG. I also said that in a later post, that was also deleted.

But, as I said, enlighten me, show me where she said that she did not mean what she said. If I'm wrong, I will apologize profusely and publicly.

You go out and tag someone as a racist and when others respond, you cry "I'm being attacked". Ok. I'm not guilty of that either. As for SG, I never said anything about her comments being sarcasm.

 

[LisaC]

rac·ism [rey-siz-uhm] noun
1. a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one's own race is superior and has the right to rule others.

2. a policy, system of government, etc., based upon or fostering such a doctrine; discrimination.

3. hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.

Why do we separate grade levels? Why do we separate genders in public restrooms? Why do we separate wild and domesticated animals? Is it the same?

The IDEALS behind the separation determine whether or not racism is present, not the act itself.


Again - before I am labeled a racist - these are not solutions in my opinion. But I think a racist label has been thrown around here without foundation. And that's shameful. :girlsaysno

Let me add to that the definition from Merriam-Webster.
Definition of RACISM1: a belief that ]race is the primary [url=http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/determinant]determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race 2: racial ]prejudice or discrimination

 

[LisaC]

To dive in and throw the yoke of "racist" around someone's neck based upon a post isn't really fair in my book. Perfect example why many people don't want to discuss the subject. Very inappropriate to shroud the topic with a label that is so inflammatory. BTW, being "offended" doesn't warrant an attack from anyone.

Really, I've been attacked throughout this thread so I thought it was okay. :dunno

And, again, in response to Diva's question about whether SG's comments were meant in sarcasm, I believe I said "ingorance." I responded to her comments, I didn't personally attack SG. I also said that in a later post, that was also deleted.

But, as I said, enlighten me, show me where she said that she did not mean what she said. If I'm wrong, I will apologize profusely and publicly.

You go out and tag someone as a racist and when others respond, you cry "I'm being attacked". Ok. I'm not guilty of that either. As for SG, I never said anything about her comments being sarcasm.

You're not Diva... Are you??? :whistle :whistle :whistle

 

[Guard Dad]

To dive in and throw the yoke of "racist" around someone's neck based upon a post isn't really fair in my book. Perfect example why many people don't want to discuss the subject. Very inappropriate to shroud the topic with a label that is so inflammatory. BTW, being "offended" doesn't warrant an attack from anyone.

Really, I've been attacked throughout this thread so I thought it was okay. :dunno

And, again, in response to Diva's question about whether SG's comments were meant in sarcasm, I believe I said "ingorance." I responded to her comments, I didn't personally attack SG. I also said that in a later post, that was also deleted.

But, as I said, enlighten me, show me where she said that she did not mean what she said. If I'm wrong, I will apologize profusely and publicly.

Read post #247. It's confusing because she was quoting you and the code broke, but she better explains what she meant.

But as I told you in a PM, her post was not directed personally at you or anyone else here, so you shouldn't take it so personally. Ease up on the caffeine

 

[LisaC]

Thank you for the prayers; I need them just like we all do and always will, and you will be in my prayers also. I AM frustrated. Just seeing and hearing the masses of blacks during this Zimmerman inicident, I feel the whites no longer have the right to a fair trial. A jury found this man innocent, and the hate the blacks are demonstrating show that YES, we WILL always have racism. Blacks kill blacks daily and they won't even help the police (as seen on TV ) ). After the killing of the Villa Rica jeweler, I have been reduced to carrying a gun now. God bless us all. My prayers have been that God end this world now before there is a race war or even worse. We are in dire need of guidance from above -- Satan is alive and well on planet earth.
I am glad this thread has some love and fun poked and hope it continues on. Thanks to my family and friends, I have loved and am loved, and will continue to be strong. Thanks all. Don't worry; be happy and try to be positive. I have had a hard time lately, but things are looking up and things WILL balance out! :love :love

Here is post 247 - I deleted the part where she was quoting what I said so that it will be easier to read. Show me where she says that she doesn't mean what she said?

She does say that she is frustrated, I can relate to that. :cantbelievemyeyes

 

[LisaC]

Read post #247. It's confusing because she was quoting you and the code broke, but she better explains what she meant.

But as I told you in a PM, her post was not directed personally at you or anyone else here, so you shouldn't take it so personally. Ease up on the caffeine

I am not taking this personally, although I do feel like I am being personally attacked here. But, trust me, you DON'T want me to ease up on the caffeine... :girlsaysno

P.S. I thought we weren't supposed to discuss things that were brought up in PMs. :dunno

 

[Guard Dad]

Read post #247. It's confusing because she was quoting you and the code broke, but she better explains what she meant.

But as I told you in a PM, her post was not directed personally at you or anyone else here, so you shouldn't take it so personally. Ease up on the caffeine

I am not taking this personally, although I do feel like I am being personally attacked here. But, trust me, you DON'T want me to ease up on the caffeine... :girlsaysno

P.S. I thought we weren't supposed to discuss things that were brought up in PMs. :dunno

Because you won't let it go.

 

[ShoeDiva]

To dive in and throw the yoke of "racist" around someone's neck based upon a post isn't really fair in my book. Perfect example why many people don't want to discuss the subject. Very inappropriate to shroud the topic with a label that is so inflammatory. BTW, being "offended" doesn't warrant an attack from anyone.

Really, I've been attacked throughout this thread so I thought it was okay. :dunno

And, again, in response to Diva's question about whether SG's comments were meant in sarcasm, I believe I said "ingorance." I responded to her comments, I didn't personally attack SG. I also said that in a later post, that was also deleted.

But, as I said, enlighten me, show me where she said that she did not mean what she said. If I'm wrong, I will apologize profusely and publicly.

You go out and tag someone as a racist and when others respond, you cry "I'm being attacked". Ok. I'm not guilty of that either. As for SG, I never said anything about her comments being sarcasm.

You're not Diva... Are you??? :whistle :whistle :whistle

:Stick I am the original Diva...he has to be second! )

 

[I'm Floored]

Normally, I wouldn't do this, but this thread is so far removed from where it began, that I want to request it be closed.

If anyone would like to continue the "discussion" that it has evolved into, please start your own thread.

 

[LisaC]

Read post #247. It's confusing because she was quoting you and the code broke, but she better explains what she meant.

But as I told you in a PM, her post was not directed personally at you or anyone else here, so you shouldn't take it so personally. Ease up on the caffeine

I am not taking this personally, although I do feel like I am being personally attacked here. But, trust me, you DON'T want me to ease up on the caffeine... :girlsaysno

P.S. I thought we weren't supposed to discuss things that were brought up in PMs. :dunno

Because you won't let it go.

Apparently, I'm not the only one - we're on page 18...

make that 19.