WTH was that presser???

lotstodo said:
People this is no grand plan by a political genius. Trump is a babbling idiot who says what pops into his head and that does great diplomatic damage. He literally sided with the Russian dictator over his own intelligence and investigative services. There is no other rationalway to interpret the words that came out of his mouth. He did this to cover his own ass, as if Putin's denial would somehow make this whole pile if crap go away, as if anyone other than himself would ever believe Putin. What Trump did was make a bad situation even worse. He helped nothing, not even himself. This was a shameful presentation of hubris.
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Not. even. close.

:nono:
 
If you read the last indictment, you will see two things that really stand out. The first is that Trump and his supporters who are babbling "Where's the server" are totally full of crap, because first of all, e-mails are not really the crux of the crimes denoted although the accusation is there, and second of all, asking that question is like asking "where's the house" when you know where the mailbox is and it's all registered mail. It's a moot point. We can trace messages to and from an IP address, we don't need a hard drive.

The second thing you will see is that the connections made between these individuals and their crimes are well documented in the indictment. We have records, money, communications, receipts, pretty much everything necessary for a full conviction, let alone an indictment. These people did it unless the indictment is a complete fabrication from whole cloth. "It" in this case is setting up a US operation to disseminate both false and stolen information and to obscure the real source and value through identity theft, money laundering, and wire and bank fraud. The intended result was pretty obviously to sew dissent and division in an attempt to damage Hillary. Now as to their connection to the Russian government, these are for the most part known operatives, and their travels are documented. Putin himself said something to the effect that we can question them when he can question our spies in Russia. That is really not even a question.

Now that we have pretty well established a conspiracy to alter the results of a US Presidential election (by nearly all accounts not successful, but still a criminal attempt) we come to the part that anyone but a buffoon like Trump would be pointing to instead of calling our domestic institutions incompetent or mistaken. That is the clear statement in the indictment that any and all Trump supporters and campaign workers in the Trump organization who cooperated directly with these people did so without knowledge of their true identity. This is what he should be pointing to, but that should be here at home. In Helsinki he should have reiterated the US position that Russian operatives carried out covert operations with the intent of interfering in our election, nothing more. He most certainly should not ever offer up the excuse of the dictator standing next to him as a statement of his policy or position. Never. Period. Putin was there and could have said whatever he wanted in response.

As to how bad a debacle this is, we will see. It absolutely is not something that is just going to be sloughed off as a "Trumpism". It is a major misstep and it makes him and our intelligence services look worse than bad. It shows that he is so concerned with his own image that he will go to any end to defend himself, even taking the side of a Russian dictator over us. Maybe the worse part of that is that he is a dismal failure even at that.

Here is the indictment. If you haven't read it, you probably should. As I said months ago, I think we will eventually find procedural violations within the Trump organization, but not clear-cut collusion with Russia. So far, that has been the case. Hopefully this will run it's course soon, it's time for Mueller to put up or shut up.

https://www.justice.gov/file/1080281/download
 
He told you exactly what his intention was here :

"I would rather take a political risk in pursuit of peace, than to risk peace in pursuit of politics."

How best to achieve Trump's foreign policy objectives ? ? ?
How best to persuede Putin in a mutually beneficial relationship ? ? ?

Do you know that we annihilated an entire Russian battalion in Syria not long ago ? ? ?

100% casualties. We've never done that before.

Your faith in our intelligence services is curious,
given what we know about their incompetence and their targeting of Trump.

The timing of the release of this indictment is more than curious.

The dissemination of false information in an attempt to influence the election...
sounds like an indictment of the media. Certainly not the crime of the century.

Would we be talking about any of this had the election went the other way ? ? ?

Not a snowball's chance in hell...
 
It's naive NOT to think every national election faces foreign threats and attempts to alter the outcome. Does anyone here honestly believe it doesn't happen, or that we don't attempt the same? Publicly humiliating or chastising Putin is not a wise move and especially while in his own country. That would definitely result in political damage which we hit on earlier. But I'll bite...let's assume Trump had been firm in holding Putin's hands to the fire and warned him not to get involved in the next election or else. He didn't say it, but let's assume he did....the talking points today would be: "Trump admits the Russians helped him win" "Trump won because the Russians didn't want HRC", "the Russians and Trump and buddies", "Trump paid off the Russians", as well as many more. The whole press meeting in Russia was an attempt to snare Trump and he didn't fall for it. He's not the typical politician, he doesn't follow the normal set of rules although apparently he does follow the law.

I expect the Russians to attempt to affect our electoral process every chance they get, as well as China and even some of our EU "friends." I don't expect our FBI leadership to be corrupt to the bone. I don't expect our former First Lady, Presidential candidate, and Senator to conduct criminal acts much less be held completely unaccountable for such actions. I don't expect our Special Counsels and Congressional Committees to act unbridled with such political bias.

So Trump flubbed it up, shame on him. If that's the worst he does then we can all count ourselves very lucky. By the way, does he get any positive credit for today's news conference where he attempted to clarify some of his comments? I didn't think so.
 
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“Yesterday, we made significant progress toward addressing some of the worst conflicts on Earth.”

- President Donald J. Trump

:):):)
 
Nobody, at least nobody I've heard, has suggested that Trump publicly hold Putin's hand to the fire. I suggested that his answer to the AP question should have been the US already stated public position. That is that we believe, and have evidence that people working on behalf of the Russian government attempted to interfere in our election. He didn't have to say one word more. As for privately, I would hope that he strongly suggested that we won't tolerate any such thing again, and if it happens, there will be consequences.

Oh, and he deserves some credit for walking back his statement, but he didn't admit that anything he said in Helsinki was out of line. Kind of a half mia culpa, but I'll take it.
 
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IMO...

Something to consider:

The media wants to crucify Trump... and it is proven time and time again... they will lie, invent fake news, mis-represtent the facts, etc...
To advance their agenda.

So IMO...
UNTIL we know the WHOLE story... which will take weeks...
Forming an opinion... is kinda letting the media control ones thoughts.

For me... I do NOT trust the MSM...
And will NOT form an opinion...
Until I hear the whole story.

Carry on... :)
 
cptlo306 said:
They were in Finland. And he apparently didn't mind humiliating U.S. intelligence agencies while defending Russia.
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True, I was typing faster than my brain could process but that's easy to do these days. I'm just saying confronting Putin in a combative nature while attempting to come to agreements on other sensitive issues isn't a good idea, especially when standing next to him and not "at home." Throwing our agencies under the bus isn't any better of an idea but I've already stated Trump flubbed it up. Time will tell if the meeting brings forth any fruit.
 
Guard Dad said:
I think that's the biggest reason the Dems scream about Trump all the time, to cover their own evils.
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Thank you. Here's a thought....we won't have Trump one day, whether it be 2020 or 2024. Then what? And what if the dems win then.

I'm done for the night. Sweet dreams of HRC to all and to all a good night!!
 
First of all, ya'll need to remember who was president during the election and the period Putin said this went down - Obama. We already have seen how corrupt the DOJ was when it came to protecting HRC from being indicted for violating laws regarding the transmission of classified information over non-secured email servers. Why is it not possible for our intelligence community to have been corrupted by that administration as well?
 
The second Iranian revolution is about to begin...

I believe that Trump was meeting with Putin to bring him into the fold.

The mullahs have just been thrown under the bus.

Now we wait and watch as the Iranian people secure their freedom...

I'm going to guess that the action will ramp up in September /October.

:cool:
 
lotstodo said:
How I the hell can you defend this? All he did was ask where Hillary's server was and say that Putin made a good case for it not being him who hacked it. He was literally repeating Russian talking points, when two Congressional committees and two independent council's have concluded based upon our intelligence that it was Russia.

No collusion no collusion! What an asshat. It doesn't matter that the outcome wasn't changed, it doesn't matter if Trump was or wasn't involved, Russia was involved, we know this for a fact, and we should take that stand. Total bullcrap on Trump's part, trying to cover his own ass when he should have been standing up for our's.

Russia is not our ally. We should be talking to them, but not cowering like Obama, saying that both sides made mistakes, "the Democrats made mistakes"

Oh. My. God. What an idiot.
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Well for one thing Trump is no commie loving Democrat who will sell the US out like Obama and Hilary. There is no comparison to the Democrats and globalists sell out Republicans we have had in the office before. Reagan was the last good President before Trump and others were not American IMHO. Thank you very much
 
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