Generation Gaps

[Blazing Saddles]

I cannot believe what I am reading here in this thread. I am NOT going to type out a long explanation why I think certain things are important. Cursive......not needed today for many reasons but can still be relevant at some point in life. Don't ever think you won't NEED something. Math?.........no doubter. When a person at a cash register can't give correct change without a calculator, we've got problems. At least know enough so you can tell whether the gov't shorted you on your welfare check. As for spelling......I'll say it is just IDIOTIC to believe you don't need it. Yep, idiotic. Don't quote me and say I call you a name and report it.....I don't care. Don't ask me why someone should need it. Go out and learn that one for yourself. BTW, I didn't use spell check one time on this whole post. Why? Because I can spell. Thank you very much.

 

[Lawguy]

Actually, let me go a few steps further. This one has angered a few parents (and administrators).

I won't accept work that is riddled with misspellings and grammatical errors or is so sloppy that I struggle to read it. I tell students that any work we do reflects on us and our work ethic. We an't expect to turn in "crap" for the work we don't care about in the hopes that we will get to do the work we want to do.

I don't tell them this, but I have to do an excellent job teaching Biology even though I hate the subject and have no interest in it. My teaching in Biology reflects on the kind of job I will do in other subjects and other jobs. So, I do my best, and have actually learned a lot that has served me well as I teach other subjects. Always present your best face and do your best job.

I agree that this is important.
I am constantly surprised at how many apparently educated people are completely unable to express themsleves orally or in writing.
Lawyers included.

 

[Guard Dad]

Actually, let me go a few steps further. This one has angered a few parents (and administrators).

I won't accept work that is riddled with misspellings and grammatical errors or is so sloppy that I struggle to read it. I tell students that any work we do reflects on us and our work ethic. We an't expect to turn in "crap" for the work we don't care about in the hopes that we will get to do the work we want to do.

I don't tell them this, but I have to do an excellent job teaching Biology even though I hate the subject and have no interest in it. My teaching in Biology reflects on the kind of job I will do in other subjects and other jobs. So, I do my best, and have actually learned a lot that has served me well as I teach other subjects. Always present your best face and do your best job.

I agree that this is important.
I am constantly surprised at how many apparently educated people are completely unable to express themsleves orally or in writing.
Lawyers included.

I think you mean verbally... ;D

 

[ShoeDiva]

I cannot believe what I am reading here in this thread. I am NOT going to type out a long explanation why I think certain things are important. Cursive......not needed today for many reasons but can still be relevant at some point in life. Don't ever think you won't NEED something. Math?.........no doubter. When a person at a cash register can't give correct change without a calculator, we've got problems. At least know enough so you can tell whether the gov't shorted you on your welfare check. As for spelling......I'll say it is just IDIOTIC to believe you don't need it. Yep, idiotic. Don't quote me and say I call you a name and report it.....I don't care. Don't ask me why someone should need it. Go out and learn that one for yourself. BTW, I didn't use spell check one time on this whole post. Why? Because I can spell. Thank you very much.

Okay I will just say your post was not necessary. No need to be so condescending. Glad you know so much and are so high and mighty.

BTW...I can spell, write in cursive, and do math. Funny I really do not even remember anyone stating math was not needed except in jest.

 

[naturegirl]

Actually, let me go a few steps further. This one has angered a few parents (and administrators).

I won't accept work that is riddled with misspellings and grammatical errors or is so sloppy that I struggle to read it. I tell students that any work we do reflects on us and our work ethic. We an't expect to turn in "crap" for the work we don't care about in the hopes that we will get to do the work we want to do.

I don't tell them this, but I have to do an excellent job teaching Biology even though I hate the subject and have no interest in it. My teaching in Biology reflects on the kind of job I will do in other subjects and other jobs. So, I do my best, and have actually learned a lot that has served me well as I teach other subjects. Always present your best face and do your best job.

I agree that this is important.
I am constantly surprised at how many apparently educated people are completely unable to express themsleves orally or in writing.
Lawyers included.

I think you mean verbally... ;D

:faint

 

[Blazing Saddles]

I cannot believe what I am reading here in this thread. I am NOT going to type out a long explanation why I think certain things are important. Cursive......not needed today for many reasons but can still be relevant at some point in life. Don't ever think you won't NEED something. Math?.........no doubter. When a person at a cash register can't give correct change without a calculator, we've got problems. At least know enough so you can tell whether the gov't shorted you on your welfare check. As for spelling......I'll say it is just IDIOTIC to believe you don't need it. Yep, idiotic. Don't quote me and say I call you a name and report it.....I don't care. Don't ask me why someone should need it. Go out and learn that one for yourself. BTW, I didn't use spell check one time on this whole post. Why? Because I can spell. Thank you very much.

Okay I will just say your post was not necessary. No need to be so condescending. Glad you know so much and are so high and mighty.

BTW...I can spell, write in cursive, and do math. Funny I really do not even remember anyone stating math was not needed except in jest.

SD, my opinion tells me my post is just as necessary as yours. It's not condescending but instead contrasting an idea that obviously wasn't thought out very well. As for the math, someone made a legitimate comparison with a calculator and it was brushed off as if it wasn't the same ideal. That's why I stated what I did. :B_S

 

[ShoeDiva]

I cannot believe what I am reading here in this thread. I am NOT going to type out a long explanation why I think certain things are important. Cursive......not needed today for many reasons but can still be relevant at some point in life. Don't ever think you won't NEED something. Math?.........no doubter. When a person at a cash register can't give correct change without a calculator, we've got problems. At least know enough so you can tell whether the gov't shorted you on your welfare check. As for spelling......I'll say it is just IDIOTIC to believe you don't need it. Yep, idiotic. Don't quote me and say I call you a name and report it.....I don't care. Don't ask me why someone should need it. Go out and learn that one for yourself. BTW, I didn't use spell check one time on this whole post. Why? Because I can spell. Thank you very much.

Okay I will just say your post was not necessary. No need to be so condescending. Glad you know so much and are so high and mighty.

BTW...I can spell, write in cursive, and do math. Funny I really do not even remember anyone stating math was not needed except in jest.

SD, my opinion tells me my post is just as necessary as yours. It's not condescending but instead contrasting an idea that obviously wasn't thought out very well. As for the math, someone made a legitimate comparison with a calculator and it was brushed off as if it wasn't the same ideal. That's why I stated what I did. :B_S

Your opinion and thoughts are as valid as mine, how you presented them saying thoughts were idiotic and you do not care if you are reported is not. Just saying.

 

[naturegirl]

Back on track..............are are kids really being taught for the future?? Do we have any idea what we expect our educators to teach with the future in mind?? Do our educators think about the future??

I'm not sure I would be up to the task if I were teaching today. I have a deep respect for teachers that teach kids to learn. Waski, you certainly fall in that category.

 

[ShoeDiva]

Back on track..............are are kids really being taught for the future?? Do we have any idea what we expect our educators to teach with the future in mind?? Do our educators think about the future??

I'm not sure I would be up to the task if I were teaching today. I have a deep respect for teachers that teach kids to learn. Waski, you certainly fall in that category.

I agree with you. I believe they are doing what is best for our children. I only encountered one teacher of my sons that I knew should be in another profession. We dealt with it by having his grands (both teachers) help out that year. I also agree Waski is a fabulous teacher. I do not have to meet him in person to feel the love he has for his profession.

 

[Blazing Saddles]

I cannot believe what I am reading here in this thread. I am NOT going to type out a long explanation why I think certain things are important. Cursive......not needed today for many reasons but can still be relevant at some point in life. Don't ever think you won't NEED something. Math?.........no doubter. When a person at a cash register can't give correct change without a calculator, we've got problems. At least know enough so you can tell whether the gov't shorted you on your welfare check. As for spelling......I'll say it is just IDIOTIC to believe you don't need it. Yep, idiotic. Don't quote me and say I call you a name and report it.....I don't care. Don't ask me why someone should need it. Go out and learn that one for yourself. BTW, I didn't use spell check one time on this whole post. Why? Because I can spell. Thank you very much.

Okay I will just say your post was not necessary. No need to be so condescending. Glad you know so much and are so high and mighty.

BTW...I can spell, write in cursive, and do math. Funny I really do not even remember anyone stating math was not needed except in jest.

SD, my opinion tells me my post is just as necessary as yours. It's not condescending but instead contrasting an idea that obviously wasn't thought out very well. As for the math, someone made a legitimate comparison with a calculator and it was brushed off as if it wasn't the same ideal. That's why I stated what I did. :B_S

Your opinion and thoughts are as valid as mine, how you presented them saying thoughts were idiotic and you do not care if you are reported is not. Just saying.

There are times where things must be said with a little more umph to stress a point. And to think that spelling isn't necessary just screamed out the word. Take it for what it's worth and not how it's presented. :angel

 

[ShoeDiva]

I cannot believe what I am reading here in this thread. I am NOT going to type out a long explanation why I think certain things are important. Cursive......not needed today for many reasons but can still be relevant at some point in life. Don't ever think you won't NEED something. Math?.........no doubter. When a person at a cash register can't give correct change without a calculator, we've got problems. At least know enough so you can tell whether the gov't shorted you on your welfare check. As for spelling......I'll say it is just IDIOTIC to believe you don't need it. Yep, idiotic. Don't quote me and say I call you a name and report it.....I don't care. Don't ask me why someone should need it. Go out and learn that one for yourself. BTW, I didn't use spell check one time on this whole post. Why? Because I can spell. Thank you very much.

Okay I will just say your post was not necessary. No need to be so condescending. Glad you know so much and are so high and mighty.

BTW...I can spell, write in cursive, and do math. Funny I really do not even remember anyone stating math was not needed except in jest.

SD, my opinion tells me my post is just as necessary as yours. It's not condescending but instead contrasting an idea that obviously wasn't thought out very well. As for the math, someone made a legitimate comparison with a calculator and it was brushed off as if it wasn't the same ideal. That's why I stated what I did. :B_S

Your opinion and thoughts are as valid as mine, how you presented them saying thoughts were idiotic and you do not care if you are reported is not. Just saying.

There are times where things must be said with a little more umph to stress a point. And to think that spelling isn't necessary just screamed out the word. Take it for what it's worth and not how it's presented. :angel

I can relate to wanting to get a point across, but you have to have a little more finesse than report me! ) I don't love that they stopped teaching it or when they were, how they taught it, but I have also seen how it has not handicapped my son. Is he the best speller, no, but overall he can spell. Maybe it was just reading that made him catch on, maybe it was because if he asked me how to spell a word I told him to look it up in the dictionary. Whatever it is, I do not see a major issue with him not being taught. :dunno

 

[lotstodo]

My personal experience is this: We are not teaching our children to be creative, or how to translate that creativity into a vocation. We are teaching them how to make a machine solve a problem, not how to solve that problem themselves. Creativity is the basis of language, writing, arts and yes, sciences. We have been a dismal failure at this since about 1990 when computers made knowing which button to push more important than being able to visualize a concept heretofore completely unknown to our synapses. There is now far more creativity in the trades than in White collar America, and this is part of the problem. Our Children will be quite prepared to operate a cash register, but can they build a tree house? Can they draw a map? Can they explain to others what they want built? Can they effectively think for themselves?

That last one is particularly important. All of your life you have to weed out the BS from the truth. All of your life you have to communicate your needs and respond to the needs of others. There is no computer that can do that, and a trained brain is what we need. It's far more important to teach children HOW to think and create than it is to teach them what to think or how to source somebody else's opinion which, let's face it, is the main job of the computer. Access to every bit of information in the world is useless to a person who can't put that information to use in a manner that it has never been used before. That's how we innovate and grow.

My job as an Industrial Designer was once perfectly described by a foreman at a fixture and architectural millwork factory when he said: "Your job is to think up goofy s#(t, and my job is to build it." Today's goofy stuff will be tomorrows everyday. We are not teaching our children how to think up goofy stuff anymore, and that's truly sad. The idea of entrepreneurship will soon be strictly an historical concept.

 

[I'm Floored]

My personal experience is this: We are not teaching our children to be creative, or how to translate that creativity into a vocation. We are teaching them how to make a machine solve a problem, not how to solve that problem themselves. Creativity is the basis of language, writing, arts and yes, sciences. We have been a dismal failure at this since about 1990 when computers made knowing which button to push more important than being able to visualize a concept heretofore completely unknown to our synapses. There is now far more creativity in the trades than in White collar America, and this is part of the problem. Our Children will be quite prepared to operate a cash register, but can they build a tree house? Can they draw a map? Can they explain to others what they want built? Can they effectively think for themselves?

That last one is particularly important. All of your life you have to weed out the BS from the truth. All of your life you have to communicate your needs and respond to the needs of others. There is no computer that can do that, and a trained brain is what we need. It's far more important to teach children HOW to think and create than it is to teach them what to think or how to source somebody else's opinion which, let's face it, is the main job of the computer. Access to every bit of information in the world is useless to a person who can't put that information to use in a manner that it has never been used before. That's how we innovate and grow.

My job as an Industrial Designer was once perfectly described by a foreman at a fixture and architectural millwork factory when he said: "Your job is to think up goofy s#(t, and my job is to build it." Today's goofy stuff will be tomorrows everyday. We are not teaching our children how to think up goofy stuff anymore, and that's truly sad. The idea of entrepreneurship will soon be strictly an historical concept.

TRUTH!

 

[Blazing Saddles]

Learning to spell words correctly is like learning number values on a number line. Your mind can understand the value from any given point. Learning to spell words helps with prefixes, suffixes, and root words for identifying their meanings. Without that, how can you understand words at all? Isn't that how you base intelligence to some degrees? I used to think that I'd never use spelling in my line of profession when I was a child but I spent years trying to catch up because it matters in most professional settings. Especially when you're trying to communicate properly and professionally. I'm glad I had parents that saw things from a better angle than I did. Hmmmm, isn't that what being a parent is all about? I guess so.

 

[Lawguy]

Actually, let me go a few steps further. This one has angered a few parents (and administrators).

I won't accept work that is riddled with misspellings and grammatical errors or is so sloppy that I struggle to read it. I tell students that any work we do reflects on us and our work ethic. We an't expect to turn in "crap" for the work we don't care about in the hopes that we will get to do the work we want to do.

I don't tell them this, but I have to do an excellent job teaching Biology even though I hate the subject and have no interest in it. My teaching in Biology reflects on the kind of job I will do in other subjects and other jobs. So, I do my best, and have actually learned a lot that has served me well as I teach other subjects. Always present your best face and do your best job.

I agree that this is important.
I am constantly surprised at how many apparently educated people are completely unable to express themsleves orally or in writing.
Lawyers included.

I think you mean verbally... ;D

I'm fixated on "oral", but I am referring to what is known as "oral argument".

 

[Foxmeister]

My personal experience is this: We are not teaching our children to be creative, or how to translate that creativity into a vocation. We are teaching them how to make a machine solve a problem, not how to solve that problem themselves. Creativity is the basis of language, writing, arts and yes, sciences. We have been a dismal failure at this since about 1990 when computers made knowing which button to push more important than being able to visualize a concept heretofore completely unknown to our synapses. There is now far more creativity in the trades than in White collar America, and this is part of the problem. Our Children will be quite prepared to operate a cash register, but can they build a tree house? Can they draw a map? Can they explain to others what they want built? Can they effectively think for themselves?

That last one is particularly important. All of your life you have to weed out the BS from the truth. All of your life you have to communicate your needs and respond to the needs of others. There is no computer that can do that, and a trained brain is what we need. It's far more important to teach children HOW to think and create than it is to teach them what to think or how to source somebody else's opinion which, let's face it, is the main job of the computer. Access to every bit of information in the world is useless to a person who can't put that information to use in a manner that it has never been used before. That's how we innovate and grow.

My job as an Industrial Designer was once perfectly described by a foreman at a fixture and architectural millwork factory when he said: "Your job is to think up goofy s#(t, and my job is to build it." Today's goofy stuff will be tomorrows everyday. We are not teaching our children how to think up goofy stuff anymore, and that's truly sad. The idea of entrepreneurship will soon be strictly an historical concept.

Well said!!!

 

[Madea]

My son is in 7th. Limited, and I mean VERY limited attention was paid to cursive in elementary school. Not done now at all. My daughter has had even less attention to cursive than my son. If I write a note to a teacher in cursive, they both struggle to read it. And my son is a terrible speller! He may not need it for an online paper, but he sure could use it in his middle school essays. He worked on a paper last weekend, I asked him to re-write it because of misspelled words. He said it wasn't necessary. I let him turn it in, thinking he would suffer the consequences. There weren't any. :tapfoot2

When mine was at AMS he only turned in typed papers there. He had to show a handwritten, edited essay, but it had to be typed in MLA format and all turned in. Are they turning in handwritten essay's at DMS? Goodness, my son can write, but with his handwriting he would be 18 and still at AMS because no one would be able to figure out the handwriting! ) Now, he did get dinged on spelling with those because he did have spell check.

(Kids that told teachers that they did not have access to a computer would give them time to go to the lab)

No, they don't type their papers. I just seem to have higher expectations than his teachers. :tapfoot2

 

[MacDaddy]

I can see the need for cursive writing to fade, I would say it already has. It's a nice to know thing. I think most folks can only read cursive it is written well, and I dare say there are few folks that can write in a cursive hand that the majority can read.

Spelling and grammar, needs to hang around. For today and tomorrow, people need to be able to clearly communicate.

Math, everyone should know basic math. Not everyone needs to be able to calculate the circumference, learn differential equations, etc.

For the kids of the future, there are some basics which everyone needs to know. The rest, they will have to learn later in life as we have all had to do.

 

[dapandlap]

Math is very important, one may find themself needing to give an inventory of their shoe collection to their home insurer.
:jk

 

[ShoeDiva]

Math is very important, one may find themself needing to give an inventory of their shoe collection to their home insurer.
:jk

I never spoke of math not being needed, is there someone else here with an extensive shoe collection? I would love to meet her!!