Ken and Karen have had it.

lotstodo

aka "The Jackal"
The backstory of the video is that a group of protesters outside St. Louis broke down the gate to an upscale community. While it's a wonder that these two didn't accidentally shoot somebody or themselves (trigger discipline? What trigger discipline, as she swings around pointing the gun directly at her husband) their act apparently had the desired effect as you hear a protester say "Let's get outa here".

 

J-man

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Staff member
Coming to a town near you. I had a conversation about this exact scenario with my dad and brother this weekend. What would you do? A question many of us may be facing in the near future if elected officials continue sticking their heads in the sand.
 

MudFlap

Expert Driver

J-man

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Staff member
The city attorney has signaled they intend to prosecute...the homeowners.

I was waiting for that. Troubling times we now live in, damn if you do and damn if you don't. I guess their only option was waiting until they were attacked then respond.....if they could. Protecting your property is not an option, just pay the cost of repairing it I suppose.
 

MudFlap

Expert Driver
I was waiting for that. Troubling times we now live in, damn if you do and damn if you don't. I guess their only option was waiting until they were attacked then respond.....if they could. Protecting your property is not an option, just pay the cost of repairing it I suppose.
Think about it, what are the personality traits of our current civic leaders ?

I can think of two: Bullying & Cowardice

In normal times, it's troubling..... but not catastrophic.

Today, it's catastrophic.
 

lotstodo

aka "The Jackal"
I will say that what the wife did could be called brandishing since she was pointing her gun at the crowd. No self respecting DA would prosecute, but you know, it is an election year. This is right up there with Paul Howard.

They guys nd his wife are both attorneys, and wisely only spoke the right phrase " we were in fear for our lives". Let's see a prosecutor prove otherwise.

Remember, the exercise of violence self defense relies upon the prosecutor proving they were NOT in mortal fear. Would an average person in the same or similar circumstances fear for their lives? I'd be scared shitless, and I probably wouldnt have gone outside because that would signal my intent. I would have been behind glass with my family in the basement and all of us fully armed though. The first one to set foot on the front step or the first one to throw a bottle would have been dropped right through the window.
 

J-man

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Staff member
They should have both kept their fingers off the triggers and not pointed the weapon towards anyone, that's just gun safety 99-A remedial. It's just disgusting that our society has now spiraled down far enough that we may all soon be facing a similar decision.
 

The Sound Guy

Driving Instructor
Its not clear to me where the protesters were when when the homeowners walked out. Is that their gate the camera person is filming next to?

Walking out with the weapon is one thing, pointing it at unarmed people showing no intent of harm comes close to brandishing. (esp waving it around the way she is)
 

MudFlap

Expert Driver
Its not clear to me where the protesters were when when the homeowners walked out. Is that their gate the camera person is filming next to?

Walking out with the weapon is one thing, pointing it at unarmed people showing no intent of harm comes close to brandishing. (esp waving it around the way she is)
I did a quick google map search. (their home is on Portland Place in St. Louis.)


The gate (I'm assuming it's the breeched gate.) is very, very close to their property and they could have stood on their front steps to confront the crowd of protesters.
 

lotstodo

aka "The Jackal"
Its not clear to me where the protesters were when when the homeowners walked out. Is that their gate the camera person is filming next to?

Walking out with the weapon is one thing, pointing it at unarmed people showing no intent of harm comes close to brandishing. (esp waving it around the way she is)
The gate is to the neighborhood. Their house is right near the gate. She was indeed brandishing, IMO. He showed no knowledge of gun safety at all, but didn't point the gun directly at anyone that I saw.

An idiot on FB who claimed to be a Miami lawyer was on FB saying that if the protesters were armed they could have used "stand your ground" to shoot the couple. NO. Rule #1 of stand your ground is that you must be permitted to be on the ground where you stand. I told them he needed a refresher or at least a NRA certified concealed carry weapons class. If you are committing a crime, any crime, you cannot claim SYG.
 

lotstodo

aka "The Jackal"
This just in...

St. Louis PD contradicts the DA and say that their investigation clears the couple and that they may seek charges against some of the protesters for trespassing and "menacing".

I told you the guy was a big wig Democrat. I really don't know that this made a difference, but the story sure flipped this afternoon.
 

Boss 302

Pursuit Driver
I was waiting for that. Troubling times we now live in, damn if you do and damn if you don't. I guess their only option was waiting until they were attacked then respond.....if they could. Protecting your property is not an option, just pay the cost of repairing it I suppose.
Nikole Jones says destroying property that can be replaced is not violence.

 
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lotstodo

aka "The Jackal"
Just read where a Missouri Criminal defense lawyer described the state's Castle Law as the strongest in the country. He described it as a "force field". He said that in most states a attacker must enter your house in order to automatically assume the legal role of an aggressor. In Missouri, that point isn't the wall of your house, but the property line. You can literally shoot trespassers and they must be able to prove that they were there for a legitimate reason to prevail in a lawsuit against you. In order to be charged with a crime, you would need to have been reasonably aware that the person was coming to your property for a legitimate reason such as they were known to you, had an appointment, etc... This includes identifying them by uniform or vehicle before firing, such as a cop or the UPS man. Other than that, fair game.

Can we get one of those please?
 
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