Which one are you?

[LisaC]

I've been getting some good words today so I've decided to share. This little blurb reminded me why I need to read the Word every day. This is from Josh Harris's book "Humble Orthodoxy." This is a story adapted from the words of Jesus in Luke 18. >

One day two men went to church to pray.

The first man was a shallow, uninformed evangelical. Everything about him shouted of squishy theology. He didn’t know or use big theological words. He watched Christian TV and thought it was deep. He bought books from the inspirational section of the bookstore. He attended one of those megachurches where the sermons are short and the worship leaders look like American Idol contestants.

The second man who went to pray was different. He was a Christian of theological depth and substance--this was obvious by the heavy study Bible he carried with him. He only read books by long-dead theologians. He subscribed to the podcasts of all the solid, gospel-centered expository preachers who didn’t tell funny stories or make jokes in their sermons. He felt cheated if a sermon was less than an hour long.

This second man began to pray. He said, “God, I thank you that I am not like other people--doctrinally ignorant, theologically clueless, superficial in their saccharine-sweet evangelicalism. I thank you that you have made me what I am: true to good doctrine, uncompromising on teaching, orthodox to the core.”

But the first man would not even look up to heaven. Instead he beat his breast and said, “God, have mercy on me, a sinner.”
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<blockquote></blockquote> <blockquote></blockquote>He follows up with this application: “If you consider yourself a person who takes doctrine seriously, do you see yourself in this story? Has a humble gratefulness for God’s mercy been replaced by a pride in all that you know? Are you prone to have contempt or a sense of superiority toward those with less knowledge? I believe Jesus would confront our misplaced confidence just as he did the self-righteousness of the Pharisees in his day.”

<blockquote></blockquote>

 

[Madea]

Would your story work if the roles were reversed?

 

[LisaC]

Would your story work if the roles were reversed?

I think the point of the story is that sometimes we get so caught up in sharing "what we know" that we forget that we are all still sinners.

 

[Madea]

Would your story work if the roles were reversed?

I think the point of the story is that sometimes we get so caught up in sharing "what we know" that we forget that we are all still sinners.

That just didn't feel like the moral to me. :dunno

 

[LisaC]

Would your story work if the roles were reversed?

I think the point of the story is that sometimes we get so caught up in sharing "what we know" that we forget that we are all still sinners.

That just didn't feel like the moral to me. :dunno

Really, I think it makes sense. A lot of times, you see Christians who pat themselves on the on the back for all that they know and they let their pride get in the way of simply recognizing that they are as much a sinner as the rest of us.

 

[deewee]

Which one are you?

I see those Christians and I see Christians who don't have much knowledge because they got saved and pitched their tent right there, instead of digging in to God's word and daily seeking growth. The "feel good" kind of Christian.

 

[LisaC]

Re: Which one are you?

I see those Christians and I see Christians who don't have much knowledge because they got saved and pitched their tent right there, instead of digging in to God's word and daily seeking growth. The "feel good" kind of Christian.

True. One thing I noticed about the Hubby's previous church (also southern Baptist) is that they aren't always that good at discipling new believers. You get saved, they dunk you and pat you on the back, and move on to the next person.

 

[Hankster]

I think I'm both. Is that bad? I'm still in the process of learning more about the Bible.

 

[LisaC]

I think I'm both. Is that bad? I'm still in the process of learning more about the Bible.

Neither one is bad IMO as long as you don't let pride get in the way.

 

[Hankster]

OK, I'm good. I have no pride whatsoever.

 

[deewee]

Which one are you?

I see those Christians and I see Christians who don't have much knowledge because they got saved and pitched their tent right there, instead of digging in to God's word and daily seeking growth. The "feel good" kind of Christian.

True. One thing I noticed about the Hubby's previous church (also southern Baptist) is that they aren't always that good at discipling new believers. You get saved, they dunk you and pat you on the back, and move on to the next person.

For me, that's when God sent precious Godly women into my life to mentor me. And He also allowed some heart breaking life events to draw me into closer relationship with Him. My personal growth has been less to do with my church discipling me as it was God, himself, drawing me to Himself. The pastor and my church family have mostly been vessels of His grace and much spiritual support than anything else. That's not up say that we don't have opportunities to come together and learn, outside of Sunday mornings, though.

I dearly dearly love my home church and deeply miss living close by.

 

[Genevieve]

I dunno...I think Harris sets up a false dichotomy. If a person is serious about pursuing a deep and well-reasoned faith, he's not going to be so shallow as to only like hour-long sermons (???!!!) and long-dead theologians...

 

[Grey Colson]

2 Timothy 2:15

Study to show thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

IMHO, the two distinct lines drawn by the two people in his writing are bold, without anyone in-between.

I've never been into reading others books about the Bible when I have a Bible to read. I never claim to know it all and clearly recognize I'm a sinner. I was born into sin and will not cease being a sinner until I die.

I'm no fan of the "wishy-washy" Joel Osteen, but I wish I could have helped him out during his bushwacking by Pierce Morgan in this video. At 2:06 in the clip below, all he had to say is that we are ALL sinners.

CNN Official Interview: Joel Osteen 'Homosexuality is a sin'​

Why is it SO important to some to get a Christian to rip certain text out of the Bible, throw them away and refuse to accept it? Why won't people just go on their way and stop hammering people for what they simply believe? What Joel seems to be attempting to say is that he didn't write the Bible, but has chosen to simply believe what it says.

He could have said that he bought a gas grill last week and decided to put together without reading the instructions. Even though instructions were clear, he refused to put it together as instructed and was then shocked when it didn't work. All Christians are trying to do is follow the instructions and when constantly asked, reveal what those instructions say. We ALL stumble, but we have a great advocate in Jesus who reminds the Father that his children are covered by his blood and are forgiven.

I suppose some feel that if they ask the question enough times, they'll get the answer they want, like Pierce Morgan is attempting to do.

 

[LisaC]

I dunno...I think Harris sets up a false dichotomy. If a person is serious about pursuing a deep and well-reasoned faith, he's not going to be so shallow as to only like hour-long sermons ( ??? !!!) and long-dead theologians...

But I think he touched on some very good points, let me word it this way - there are Christians out there who only believe that the a certain version of the Bible is accurate and that scripture can only be interpreted a particular way - they are very rigid in their beliefs and anyone who disagrees with them is simply wrong. (I know people like this). But, there are also Christians who are more relaxed - they are also believers, but they don't study scripture as often and prefer to have their sermons to be very short and to the point. (I also know people like this).

Pride sometimes gets in the way of people who believe that they are so well-versed in the Bible and Josh Harris's story just reminded me that humility is an essential part of my faith.

 

[Genevieve]

I dunno...I think Harris sets up a false dichotomy. If a person is serious about pursuing a deep and well-reasoned faith, he's not going to be so shallow as to only like hour-long sermons ( ??? !!!) and long-dead theologians...

But I think he touched on some very good points, let me word it this way - there are Christians out there who only believe that the a certain version of the Bible is accurate and that scripture can only be interpreted a particular way - they are very rigid in their beliefs and anyone who disagrees with them is simply wrong. (I know people like this). But, there are also Christians who are more relaxed - they are also believers, but they don't study scripture as often and prefer to have their sermons to be very short and to the point. (I also know people like this).

Pride sometimes gets in the way of people who believe that they are so well-versed in the Bible and Josh Harris's story just reminded me that humility is an essential part of my faith.

Sure. I agree...like the Pharisee and the publican in Scripture. I know Harris was just trying to update that story, and perhaps ruffle the feathers of a few people he knew who prided themselves on liking hour-long sermons and long-dead theologians... I'm just in a scrappy mood today. ) )

 

[LisaC]

I dunno...I think Harris sets up a false dichotomy. If a person is serious about pursuing a deep and well-reasoned faith, he's not going to be so shallow as to only like hour-long sermons ( ??? !!!) and long-dead theologians...

But I think he touched on some very good points, let me word it this way - there are Christians out there who only believe that the a certain version of the Bible is accurate and that scripture can only be interpreted a particular way - they are very rigid in their beliefs and anyone who disagrees with them is simply wrong. (I know people like this). But, there are also Christians who are more relaxed - they are also believers, but they don't study scripture as often and prefer to have their sermons to be very short and to the point. (I also know people like this).

Pride sometimes gets in the way of people who believe that they are so well-versed in the Bible and Josh Harris's story just reminded me that humility is an essential part of my faith.

Sure. I agree...like the Pharisee and the publican in Scripture. I know Harris was just trying to update that story, and perhaps ruffle the feathers of a few people he knew who prided themselves on liking hour-long sermons and long-dead theologians... I'm just in a scrappy mood today. ) )

lol Bring it on Sister, we need scrappy around this place!! :laugh

 

[kittycat]

If you have been saved...meaning that you confess your sins and ask God to forgive you and you believe that he is your Lord of your life and you will follow him. Why would you want to go out and sin on purpose.?...we are all sinners but I believe its not the sin that sends you to hell, it's the not having a relationship with the Father daily that keeps us from not following in his will.....

 

[LisaC]

If you have been saved...meaning that you confess your sins and ask God to forgive you and you believe that he is your Lord of your life and you will follow him. Why would you want to go out and sin on purpose.?...we are all sinners but I believe its not the sin that sends you to hell, it's the not having a relationship with the Father daily that keeps us from not following in his will.....

I guess because we are human and we will make mistakes. So, if you do those things, are you still saved?

 

[kittycat]

If you have been saved...meaning that you confess your sins and ask God to forgive you and you believe that he is your Lord of your life and you will follow him. Why would you want to go out and sin on purpose.?...we are all sinners but I believe its not the sin that sends you to hell, it's the not having a relationship with the Father daily that keeps us from not following in his will.....

I guess because we are human and we will make mistakes. So, if you do those things, are you still saved?

If you are led by the Spirit of Christ.....and you know that you know in your heart your saved...then it should be no question to one self if they are going to heaven or not....but for some reason one questions if they are saved or not...something is not right.......

 

[Guard Dad]

If you have been saved...meaning that you confess your sins and ask God to forgive you and you believe that he is your Lord of your life and you will follow him. Why would you want to go out and sin on purpose.?...we are all sinners but I believe its not the sin that sends you to hell, it's the not having a relationship with the Father daily that keeps us from not following in his will.....

I guess because we are human and we will make mistakes. So, if you do those things, are you still saved?

If you are led by the Spirit of Christ.....and you know that you know in your heart your saved...then it should be no question to one self if they are going to heaven or not....but for some reason one questions if they are saved or not...something is not right.......

Satan can also put doubt in a person's heart.