Trump promises a change in gun laws

As I said on the other site, it's not so much the background check that failed, it's the ability to get information on under 18 people onto that background that failed. The Florida Dept of Children said that there was "minimal threat" through he'd been in fights, cut himself, made threats, etc. His other issues were not on the record. In this world, if you are in middle school, you should understand that what you do has consequences. Any violent actions, threats, self mutilation, between the ages of 13-18 should be considered before allowing a long weapon purchase between the ages of 19-21.

I wonder if a weapons store refused to sell a weapon to someone who was 19 and legally qualified to purchase it, because they felt that 21 was a better minimum age, would that be considered discrimination?
 
I agree with SG. Violent crimes committed by juveniles should be a part of the national data base for criminal background checks for gun purchases. The legal drinking age in each state is 21. You have to be 21 to purchase a handgun. You should also have to be 21 to purchase a long gun.
 
Boss 302 said:
I agree with SG. Violent crimes committed by juveniles should be a part of the national data base for criminal background checks for gun purchases. The legal drinking age in each state is 21. You have to be 21 to purchase a handgun. You should also have to be 21 to purchase a long gun.
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I pretty much agree. I can say from the personal experience that I have encountered at least a handful of middle schoolers, as big and strong as any adult, that I would bet will end up either dead before they reach 21 or kill someone before then. It's unbelievable!
 
Grey Colson said:
I pretty much agree. I can say from the personal experience that I have encountered at least a handful of middle schoolers, as big and strong as any adult, that I would bet will end up either dead before they reach 21 or kill someone before then. It's unbelievable!
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I agree, and I believe there are many middle school teachers who could predict future social deviants. Angry kids who have no help or intervention become angry teens.

We no longer, as a country, have facilities to send youths who need help. Teachers are not able to suggest to parents that their child is not the norm, when it comes to anger and un-social and aggressive behavior. If the school recognizes it, the district must pay to provide that child with that care. There are no funds, so no one will initiate the care for these kids that should be given help so that they don't go on to injure themselves or others.

That recent shooter in Florida needed more help than his step-mom could provide. More help than the school could provide. The accounts from students and neighbors indicate in elementary school he was in need of help. The schools no longer will protect our students from kids who most citizens can see are not stable enough for a standard educational environment.

We have no alternative schools for these angry violent preteens and teens to go. To leave them in public school just increases the chaos in our schools and leaves students to have to accept that their gut feelings are wrong as their teachers tell them to "get along" with everyone, and "be accepting."

I think we as a society are asked to be so inclusive we no longer listen to our gut and allow ourselves to be put in situations that are not safe.
 
The biggest problem is getting these people in front of a judge to have them declared a danger. This just doesn't happen. In almost every case since Sandy Hook, the perpetrator was well known to law enforcement, the mental health community, or both. Las Vegas was the only one where his doctor seemed surprised.

When a person applies for a temporary protective order, weapons should be confiscated until a judge hears the case. If a permanent order is issued, the guns should go bye bye and the perp's name should go on the list. The exact thing should happen when a person is involuntarily admitted to a hospital for mental observation. Guns get confiscated, and after the 72 hours the judge decides if you get them back. If you are a danger to yourself or others, your name goes on the list.

There are problems with the list as it exists. Names are confused, id's stolen, and mistakes happen. It is also almost impossible to correct a problem. This needs to change. It should also be possible for those who were on the list for mental health reasons to petition to be removed after five years with the approval of a licensed psychologist. Let's use the list, keep it up to date, and allow for appeals.
 
Hmmm... lessee...
*I go to a sports event: there are armed guards...
*I go to the bank... again, armed guards...
*I go to the museum... again, armed guards...
*Even malls have armed guards...

Yet the most precious and valuable thing to many folks, their children
Cannot be protected by armed guards...

Somehow, that logic just does not make sense to me... :)
 
JawJa said:
Hmmm... lessee...
*I go to a sports event: there are armed guards...
*I go to the bank... again, armed guards...
*I go to the museum... again, armed guards...
*Even malls have armed guards...

Yet the most precious and valuable thing to many folks, their children
Cannot be protected by armed guards...

Somehow, that logic just does not make sense to me... :)
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Yeah... in many schools... but this school had one and he chickened out. I guess it was above his pay grade. :fingerwag::faint:

Peterson started with the Broward Sheriff’s Office in July 1985 and has been the school resource officer at Stoneman Douglas since 2009. His personnel record is filled with commendations: Four years ago, he was named school resource officer of the year. A year ago, a supervisor nominated him for Parkland deputy of the year.

In 2016, his annual base salary was $75,673.72, according to Sheriff’s Office records. Overtime and other compensation pushed the figure to $101,013.

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/local/b...ol-shooting-scot-peterson-20180223-story.html

The armed officer on duty at the Florida school where a shooter killed 17 people never went inside to engage the gunman and has been placed under investigation, officials announced Thursday. The school resource officer at the high school took up a position viewing the western entrance of the building that was under attack for more than four minutes, but “he never went in,” Broward County Sheriff Scott Israel said at a Thursday news conference. The shooting lasted about six minutes.
http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2018/02/22/guard-never-went-inside-florida-school/
 
Guy had 33 years in... guess his retirement was more important... (yeah, I know... that is kinda a negative comment).

OTOH... if we taxpayers are gonna pay someone to protect our kids...
IMO they need a soldiers attitude towards the enemy (hate to use that word enemy in reference to a teen-aged US citizen... however when the kid made the choice to do what he did... well... :( )
 
From what my son told me, as of about 8 years ago, school resource officers in Paulding were rotated off the normal force at 6-8 week intervals to keep themselves fresh with all aspects of law enforcement. Not sure if that's still true or not.

Sounds like after 8 years in the school, this guy might have not been accustomed to armed confrontation.
 
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Arrest and imprison Sheriff Israel for gross incompliance and train the deputies to respond to an active shooter by going immediately the to sound of gun fire. Thank you very much.
 
honeybunny said:
All they had to do was arrest him just once... then his record would have prevented the sale.
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He would have to be convicted or under indictment on a felony or violent misdemeanor as an adult. I'm not saying that that shouldn't have happened, but it narrows the window of probability a little bit.

One of the changes we need to be looking at is not expunging certain crimes committed as a juvenile from the record, at least not for several years. As I've said before, if we are going to have a database, lets correct it, update it, and use it to the best of our ability to keep those who are a danger from possessing guns. We also need to remember that it should be used to clear people too. The error rate that it currently has is really unacceptable, particularly in this day and age where Facebook probably knows more about you than the NICS.
 
lotstodo said:
He would have to be convicted or under indictment on a felony or violent misdemeanor as an adult. I'm not saying that that shouldn't have happened, but it narrows the window of probability a little bit.

One of the changes we need to be looking at is not expunging certain crimes committed as a juvenile from the record, at least not for several years. As I've said before, if we are going to have a database, lets correct it, update it, and use it to the best of our ability to keep those who are a danger from possessing guns. We also need to remember that it should be used to clear people too. The error rate that it currently has is really unacceptable, particularly in this day and age where Facebook probably knows more about you than the NICS.
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He committed numerous arrestable offenses :

https://www.realclearinvestigations...cipline_policy_and_the_parkland_shooting.html

;)
 
lotstodo said:
Did he not commit these "crimes" as a juvenile? If so then they would not be available on the NICS under current law. He would have to be arrested and convicted of a felony or violent misdemeanor as an adult.
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It is my understanding, that under Florida law, a felony conviction as a minor would have remained on his record... thus preventing the sale.
 
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