A higher standard?

[LisaC]

This is based on a discussion that I had with a friend. Do you think pastors should be held to a higher standard than the rest of us? Also, how do you discipline a pastor? Or is that solely up to God?




Thoughts folks? :dunno

 

[mei lan]

Yes to the first question. James 3:1 says teachers are judged more strictly.

As to the second question, that would depend on the authority structure of the church.
I

 

[J-man]

Yes to the first, no to the second. They are held to a high level of accountability but it's not my job to discipline individually. I got enough planks in my eye sockets, I can't see others.

 

[LisaC]

Yes to the first, no to the second. They are held to a high level of accountability but it's not my job to discipline individually. I got enough planks in my eye sockets, I can't see others.

Trust me, my plank is huge! Our discussion was more in line with how does a church hold a pastor accountable - or should they?

 

[deewee]

Yes to the first, no to the second. They are held to a high level of accountability but it's not my job to discipline individually. I got enough planks in my eye sockets, I can't see others.

Trust me, my plank is huge! Our discussion was more in line with how does a church hold a pastor accountable - or should they?

I believe they should, but should do so prayerfully.

 

[stradial]

Yes.
With a stick.
No.

(ok, maybe the 2nd answer is not the best way)

 

[I'm Floored]

Both questions are answered in Scripture.

 

[mei lan]

Yes to the first, no to the second. They are held to a high level of accountability but it's not my job to discipline individually. I got enough planks in my eye sockets, I can't see others.

Trust me, my plank is huge! Our discussion was more in line with how does a church hold a pastor accountable - or should they?

Srsly? The option NOT to discipline a pastor is on the table? Besides the damage he could potentially do to the Kingdom of God*, left unchecked, he could cause great harm to the church itself in many, MANY ways. I should think the threat of firing would be among the options of a church whose pastor had committed a firing offense.** I think the board of elders/whatever should have final say. Not just because of this but because you don't want a church built around a man and that's hard enough to avoid even with a governing body.

* God is perfectly able to take up for Himself...I'm just sayin'...

** I do recognize that there are churches out there that are basically little community fiefdoms with the deacons hanging firing over the preacher's head at all times for anything they dream up if it suitsnthem. Not talking about that.

 

[Madea]

Yes they should and depends on what type of offense we are discussing.

 

[LisaC]

Yes to the first, no to the second. They are held to a high level of accountability but it's not my job to discipline individually. I got enough planks in my eye sockets, I can't see others.

Trust me, my plank is huge! Our discussion was more in line with how does a church hold a pastor accountable - or should they?

Srsly? The option NOT to discipline a pastor is on the table? Besides the damage he could potentially do to the Kingdom of God*, left unchecked, he could cause great harm to the church itself in many, MANY ways. I should think the threat of firing would be among the options of a church whose pastor had committed a firing offense.** I think the board of elders/whatever should have final say. Not just because of this but because you don't want a church built around a man and that's hard enough to avoid even with a governing body.

* God is perfectly able to take up for Himself...I'm just sayin'...

** I do recognize that there are churches out there that are basically little community fiefdoms with the deacons hanging firing over the preacher's head at all times for anything they dream up if it suitsnthem. Not talking about that.

It was explained to me that the pastor should be treated like Moses, as untouchable. I spent last night looking for scripture to back up that argument, but couldn't find anything so I decided to reach out to y'all. So, if you know of a scripture that supports that, please share it. I came from a Methodist church where church discipline was clearly spelled out according to scripture and everyone (including leadership) was held to that standard so this is a new point of view for me so I want to learn more about it.

 

[stradial]

Yes to the first, no to the second. They are held to a high level of accountability but it's not my job to discipline individually. I got enough planks in my eye sockets, I can't see others.

Trust me, my plank is huge! Our discussion was more in line with how does a church hold a pastor accountable - or should they?

Srsly? The option NOT to discipline a pastor is on the table? Besides the damage he could potentially do to the Kingdom of God*, left unchecked, he could cause great harm to the church itself in many, MANY ways. I should think the threat of firing would be among the options of a church whose pastor had committed a firing offense.** I think the board of elders/whatever should have final say. Not just because of this but because you don't want a church built around a man and that's hard enough to avoid even with a governing body.

* God is perfectly able to take up for Himself...I'm just sayin'...

** I do recognize that there are churches out there that are basically little community fiefdoms with the deacons hanging firing over the preacher's head at all times for anything they dream up if it suitsnthem. Not talking about that.

It was explained to me that the pastor should be treated like Moses, as untouchable. I spent last night looking for scripture to back up that argument, but couldn't find anything so I decided to reach out to y'all. So, if you know of a scripture that supports that, please share it. I came from a Methodist church where church discipline was clearly spelled out according to scripture and everyone (including leadership) was held to that standard so this is a new point of view for me so I want to learn more about it.

As you know, I have issues with organized religion.
They are my issues, not any religion's issues.
But if someone told me the "leader" of anything was "untouchable", it would send up major red flags to me.

 

[LisaC]

Yes to the first, no to the second. They are held to a high level of accountability but it's not my job to discipline individually. I got enough planks in my eye sockets, I can't see others.

Trust me, my plank is huge! Our discussion was more in line with how does a church hold a pastor accountable - or should they?

Srsly? The option NOT to discipline a pastor is on the table? Besides the damage he could potentially do to the Kingdom of God*, left unchecked, he could cause great harm to the church itself in many, MANY ways. I should think the threat of firing would be among the options of a church whose pastor had committed a firing offense.** I think the board of elders/whatever should have final say. Not just because of this but because you don't want a church built around a man and that's hard enough to avoid even with a governing body.

* God is perfectly able to take up for Himself...I'm just sayin'...

** I do recognize that there are churches out there that are basically little community fiefdoms with the deacons hanging firing over the preacher's head at all times for anything they dream up if it suitsnthem. Not talking about that.

It was explained to me that the pastor should be treated like Moses, as untouchable. I spent last night looking for scripture to back up that argument, but couldn't find anything so I decided to reach out to y'all. So, if you know of a scripture that supports that, please share it. I came from a Methodist church where church discipline was clearly spelled out according to scripture and everyone (including leadership) was held to that standard so this is a new point of view for me so I want to learn more about it.

As you know, I have issues with organized religion.
They are my issues, not any religion's issues.
But if someone told me the "leader" of anything was "untouchable", it would send up major red flags to me.

I'm not ready to throw up a red flag (not yet anyway), but this is the first time I have ever heard that description applied to a pastor. I do feel like I need to say that this isn't any type of witch hunt for a pastor or his job, but was merely a discussion about church discipline and this point of view was vehemently shared.

 

[stradial]

The first rule of a good cult, is that the leader is not subjected to the same rules as everyone else and they are not held accountable for their actions.

Now I am not saying your church is a cult, by any means.
I am saying that, to me, the thinking that anyone is "untouchable" or uncountable, is a dangerous thing.
Even if that person is a good and honorable person.

 

[Ponytail Patriot]

[size=10pt]The Bible is full of examples where those who answered the call of God were held to a higher standard. Are pastors today any more special than those Biblical prophets? NO! Any individual who seeks leadership in any way, whether it be religion, politics, community, etc, have put themselves in a position to live up to the standards they have ascribed to.

As for discipline, most organized religions (denominations) have a policy set forth for the discipline of their pastors/bishops/ ministers. More often than not however, it is left up to the congregation to bring whatever offense the pastor has committed to the attention of those above him.

With all of that being said, we (as mere humans) should never hold someone to a standard that we are not willing to rise to ourselves. To do so would be casting stones from behind the walls of our glass houses.[/size]

 

[LisaC]

The first rule of a good cult, is that the leader is not subjected to the same rules as everyone else and they are not held accountable for their actions.

Now I am not saying your church is a cult, by any means.
I am saying that, to me, the thinking that anyone is "untouchable" or uncountable, is a dangerous thing.
Even if that person is a good and honorable person.

Don't worry, I get what you're saying. Our church has specific guidelines on discipline - all in line with Matthew 18. This isn't a "church" belief, this is simply one person's belief.

 

[stradial]

The first rule of a good cult, is that the leader is not subjected to the same rules as everyone else and they are not held accountable for their actions.

Now I am not saying your church is a cult, by any means.
I am saying that, to me, the thinking that anyone is "untouchable" or uncountable, is a dangerous thing.
Even if that person is a good and honorable person.

Don't worry, I get what you're saying. Our church has specific guidelines on discipline - all in line with Matthew 18. This isn't a "church" belief, this is simply one person's belief.

I understand.

 

[LisaC]

The first rule of a good cult, is that the leader is not subjected to the same rules as everyone else and they are not held accountable for their actions.

Now I am not saying your church is a cult, by any means.
I am saying that, to me, the thinking that anyone is "untouchable" or uncountable, is a dangerous thing.
Even if that person is a good and honorable person.

Don't worry, I get what you're saying. Our church has specific guidelines on discipline - all in line with Matthew 18. This isn't a "church" belief, this is simply one person's belief.

I understand.

Now, please also understand that just because I have purchase one pair of Crocs, this does not mean that we have formed our own cult.... :taunt

 

[ShoeDiva]

The first rule of a good cult, is that the leader is not subjected to the same rules as everyone else and they are not held accountable for their actions.

Now I am not saying your church is a cult, by any means.
I am saying that, to me, the thinking that anyone is "untouchable" or uncountable, is a dangerous thing.
Even if that person is a good and honorable person.

Don't worry, I get what you're saying. Our church has specific guidelines on discipline - all in line with Matthew 18. This isn't a "church" belief, this is simply one person's belief.

I understand.

Now, please also understand that just because I have purchase one pair of Crocs, this does not mean that we have formed our own cult.... :taunt

I promise I will be there to intervene!!!!!!!!!!! ;D

 

[MacDaddy]

You might find this article interesting http://www.insight.org/resources/articles/church/fallen-leader.html?t=pastors

Myself, I believe that leaders of the church should be held to a high standard. I also realize that they are, like most of us, only human.

Punishment? Depends.

 

[Waski_the_Squirrel]

Most denominations have a process for pastoral discipline. If the church happens to be independent, the church is on its own.

And I absolutely believe some professions should be held to a higher standard than others. As a teacher, I am. A pastor is also held to a higher standard. Part of these professions is to be a role model.